CAM - General Discussions

[RippleJet]

Most old ploppable (functional) lots have the same errors as the old growable ( stage 8 ) lots...
wrong occupancy, too high garbage pollution and too high water consumption.

[bendy]

I do not have an extensive answer to that. Farming is handled differently than the other RCI types.
If you look at the workforce drives you will also see that uneducated poor sims demand a lot more than 100% farming jobs...

One explanation to this might be the fact that not only the farm houses provide jobs. There are jobs in the fields as well (1 per tile).
Maybe the actual number of jobs a farm offers is 20% of the sum of the farm house itself and all fields that belong to it...

Thanks RippleJet, I guess the geek inside me isn't going to get satisfaction on this one. I did also notice that the workforce drives for IR were ridiculously high but wasn't too worried about that since they are meant to add up to over 100% anyway.

Your explanation makes sense. The farmhouse job listing could be  the number of jobs with a 'standard' number of fields so it is reduced when actually calculating how many jobs are available.

BTW, does anyone know if the SimGoober farms are to be made campatible in the same way as the Newman Inc and BLS ones have been?

[BarbyW]

Eventually all simgoober and CSX farms will be updated but at the moment they are already CAMpatible in that they will grow with CAM in plugins. There are currently no SG or CSX farms over stage 3 so that will need to be looked at. I am waiting to hear from SG and will do some updating when I know how he wants it doing.
Regarding the Cleanitol list, remember those lists can be used to just check if you have the necessary files. There is no obligation to remove anything although even if you do you will find the removed files in My Documents\SimCity 4\BSC_Cleanitol in a sub folder with the date of removal so you can easily retrieve any you do want back.

[snorrelli]

Most old ploppable (functional) lots have the same errors as the old growable ( stage 8 ) lots...
wrong occupancy, too high garbage pollution and too high water consumption.

Regarding the Cleanitol list, remember those lists can be used to just check if you have the necessary files. There is no obligation to remove anything although even if you do you will find the removed files in My Documents\SimCity 4\BSC_Cleanitol in a sub folder with the date of removal so you can easily retrieve any you do want back.

OK, but no new ploppable lots are being released as yet, correct? I'd like to get rid of the old growable lots but I don't necessarily want to lose the ability to plop some of these unless there will be alternative plops...

[BarbyW]

I have no intention of updating any lots from other than BSC. I am currently working through cerulean's and have have just about done the growables but the ploppables will have to wait for the time being. I have to do the COBB growables next. Hopefully I shall be able to release the updated growables in the next week to 10 days as they are in testing at the moment. The lots will have the same TGIs as the originals so they must be removed before the new ones are installed.

[snorrelli]

There is no obligation to remove anything ...

The lots will have the same TGIs as the originals so they must be removed before the new ones are installed.

Now I'm totally confused...

[BarbyW]

The lots will have the same TGIs as the originals so they must be removed before the new ones are installed.

This only applies to the updated cerulean and cobb32118 lots. You only need to remove the originals if you want the updates as they will have the same TGI and lot as the originals.

The CAM Cleanitol file only dealt with the models not the lots and for anything other than cerulean and cobb32118 lots it will be entirely up to individuals whether they keep the original lots from, for example, NDEX or bixel. Shortly I shall start on garyreggae's lots and the same will apply to them as the updates will have the same TGI as the originals.

It is a bit confusing but I have no remit to update any lots other than BSC so it will be a case of either removing the non BSC growables or living with lots growing at the wrong stage with poor stats. Any updated BSC lots will have, if they are over stage 8 for RC and 3 for I, the CAMelot query and additional OGs for the CAMeLot counter.

[Diggis]

Does this mean we just have to remove the existing models, but the lot file will remain the same? So if it's already growing it won't be an issue?

[BarbyW]

Models should not be removed unless they now form part of a MEGA pack like those from cerulean or cobb32118 - and that should have been done when the packs were installed. When I upload the updated lots I shall include a Cleanitol file for removal of the original lots but any grown in a city should not be affected. I have, for my own use only, run all simgoober's lots through the X Tool - and that was a long and tedious job - I have been in and out of cities with the original lots in and none of the cities crashed so hopefully the same will apply with these for anyone else

[snorrelli]

Does this mean we just have to remove the existing models, but the lot file will remain the same? So if it's already growing it won't be an issue?

Alright, I think I've got it on the ploppable issue - removing the old ploppable lots will result in having no ploppables at all and keeping them in will not result in duplicate, CAM and non-CAM ploppables... for now, anyway.

For the growables (at least the BSC ones that you have permission to modify), keeping the old TGIs seems like the way to go, since it relieves you of the worry of removing lots that have already grown in some cities. Do I understand correctly, however, that the BSC lots included in the CAMelot packs that are already out (particularly SG and jestarr industrials, of which I have almost all) do not use the old TGIs?

This means that those original lots cannot be removed if they have already grown in our cities, so we must either deal with duplicate lot files or bulldoze all instances and remove the originals, correct?

[BarbyW]

At the moment none of the already uploaded CAMeLots are replacements for the originals. I just used what ever building came to hand to make as wide a variety as I could. They do not, therefore, use the old TGIs.
As I said I have just about finished cerulean's and will finish cobb32118's tomorrow. Once I have actually checked them in game - not all but a reasonable proportion - I shall have to package and then upload. For speed I shall reuse the original STEX images as the lot remains the same but the custom queries have been removed as well as the stats updated. I suspect I shall make one upload for each BATter with all lots in but I am not sure at the moment.

[Diggis]

Just a thought, If I don't have the original I would have to install that first and then use the cleanitol file, and then install the new CAM building?  I haven't done anything with this at the moment, just curious,

[BarbyW]

You only need to download any lots that you do not have the models for and want to use. In that case you would only need to keep the model and there would be no need for the Cleanitol file. If it is for cerulean or cobb32118 updates the models are in MEGA packs so you would only need the packs and the new updated lots not the originals. Clear as mud?

[snorrelli]

Whew, Barby!

I remember when the BSC Farming EP came out a couple of years ago - the size of the release and the volume of questions kept you busy for a month or more, didn't it?

I admired your patience and thoughtfullness in responding to everyone's problems then and I can see we are about to witness a further display of those traits in the coming weeks... Thanks in advance!

[Indisguise]

You can change the stats of standard growables (no TE lots, no special mods to it, acts like a Maxis growable) and reopen the game and the saved cities, done this countless times, no problems no crash issues or anything.


The stats will to all the growables, change to the newly modded stats, cities once in a while will react very different, as the game updates the city to the new stats, pathfinding, power, water consumption, etc etc,. so depending on the amount of change to the stats of the buildings in the city, this could cause troubles for the city, and send it on a little roller coaster ride, but after playing the city for a while 5-10 yrs the city settles down to the new stats.

Plopables: here lies a major problem, resides in the save game (I think, ask Karybdis) but deleting or changing  the model, lot or desc file for a plopable can cause all sorts of issues, change them:

A: you have to bulldoze the lot and replop it for the new stats to take effect anyways
B: may cause a a save file corruption error if the file is deleted from the plugins (might be able to save the city with NHP tools, about a 50-50 shot)
C: a long list of bugs and issues occur when changing them or deleting, (budget slider bar to 0 being one)

this applies to your game with or without the CAM.

If you want to open older cities that include plopables and you wish to change them, Don't change the plopable files before:
1)first open the city
2)bulldoze the lots your going to change,
3)save the city,
4)apply the changes to the lots in question,
5)then reopen and replop and save the city

as for using the older files with the CAM, yes the will function, but using them may throw the game simulator out of wack because of improper stage levels and building stats. Won't crash your game, just make it very hard to play.

not removing the old files from your game, Manually or Cleanitol program,
gives the possibility of the old file growing and not the CAM lot,
also will double up on your files, about 1/2 which won't be used , this will cause the game to lag quicker.

[dioangel]

Indisguise - Nice post! 

I have a question... when is the CAM going to arrive? Is it this week? 

[BarbyW]

Maybe, maybe not but more than likely it is maybe

[figui]

ok, waiting patiently...
... well, almost patiently

[dioangel]

Maybe, maybe not but more than likely it is maybe

Ok my friend hehehe.. still waiting! 

[thundercrack83]

Maybe, maybe not but more than likely it is maybe

Oooh, a Definitely Maybe! I'll be looking forward to it!