• Welcome to SC4 Devotion Forum Archives.

RealRailway (RRW) - Development and Support

Started by Swordmaster, June 14, 2013, 08:42:19 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

isii94

The textures do have an alpha channel which was automatically created by by multifshview. After that I had to assign the FSH files to the right S3D files.
The .dat file looks like that right now:

MD coming soon...

memo

#761
Quote from: isii94 on July 17, 2014, 03:22:40 PM
And then I get this weird result


I am impressed by your way of diving into modding! A Karma point is well-deserved. :thumbsup:

The preview textures are taken directly from the FSH, so the actual problem is with your models. Perhaps the models are corrupt (you could try copying them from somewhere else and adjust the material IID) – though, I have a hunch it might be caused by the settings in the Mats section (perhaps share a screenshot of those). I think I have seen a similar issue before, but I don't remember what exactly caused it (Edit: the "texturing" flag, possibly).

Regarding your textures, I noticed that the spacing between tracks in uneven. Is the spacing between the two center tracks the same as for double-track rail (DTR)? I would recommend to adopt the minimum spacing of DTR at least because Swordmaster determined it to be the minimum possible distance and made huge efforts in adjusting the spacing of DTR for the RRW.

isii94

#762
The fast tracks (in the centre) are basically a DTR texture moved halfway across the tile border. The outer track is in the centre of the tile for STR paths to be re-used.

The Mats section looks like this on the zoom 5 tile:


Edit: The models were copied from the straight DTR piece.
MD coming soon...

memo

#763
If you select the material ID in the table and scroll down, you'll see the material settings. Make sure to select the 'texturing' flag.



Edit: You might have to adjust the other settings, too. Here are a few details about that.

isii94

#764
Thanks, memo, it worked \o/



Every time I scrolled down before, the settings were disabled (not having the texture selected, of course...)

Edit: This is how you build it right now:

MD coming soon...

APSMS

So, if I understand correctly, you've created a texture override using INRULs (?) and basically created a new kind of pseudo express network with express lines in the middle and branch/local lines on the side?!?

That's an impressive start, even if I can see immediate problems with implementation. Nice work; a K-point well deserved.
Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it.

My Mayor Diary San Diego: A Reinterpretation

GDO29Anagram

#766
Quote from: APSMS on July 18, 2014, 10:24:11 PM
So, if I understand correctly, you've created a texture override using INRULs (?) and basically created a new kind of pseudo express network with express lines in the middle and branch/local lines on the side?!?

Well, measurements aside, an INRUL-based approach at inducing an override isn't unheard of (hint hint, EDRI and FlexRamps), but even at the most prototypical levels, they come in handy if you don't know how to induce overrides using false intersections (AKA starters).

Actually, looking a page back, it's a starter based off of a "true" intersection? If so, that's unheard of; the false ones are based off of and unconventional flag configurations, but I've not heard of a starter made from a true intersection, testing or otherwise.

Also, I've never heard of a NAM newcomer tackling RUL2 right from the very beginning.

Quote from: isii94 on July 17, 2014, 03:22:40 PM
Other than that I started creating textures for some smooth curves:

There are ways to implement these in-game, using either puzzle pieces (not recommended long-term, but worth trying) or using INRUL patterns; thing is, one method has a tutorial and the other does not. However, there'd be a problem with implementing the 45-degree curve: RealRailway disables shared-tile overlapping Dual Track Rail, and you've designed it to use a shared-tile diagonal, so you may wanna rethink that.
<INACTIVE>
-----
Simtropolis | YouTube | MLP Forums

Tarkus

#767
Quote from: GDO29Anagram on July 18, 2014, 10:49:24 PM
Actually, looking a page back, it's a starter based off of a "true" intersection? If so, that's unheard of; the false ones are based off of and unconventional flag configurations, but I've not heard of a starter made from a true intersection, testing or otherwise.

Back in 2006, this sort of method was actually how qurlix set up the original "XRHW" prototype (present day RHW-8S and later 10S, as the specs changed), and the initial setups that jplumbley and I did for the TLA-5, 7, and OWR-5 used the same system.  However, the difference in that case was that every tile of the network was a literal intersection, rather than the override simply initiating the override.  It was believed at that time that there needed to be a physical connection between the tiles in order to get the game to read a multi-tile network built from a composite of smaller networks (which actually rendered these early prototypes completely intolerant to slopes), though memo fortunately disproved it.  This whole discussion can actually be seen in the old RHW development thread at ST.

Quote from: GDO29Anagram on July 18, 2014, 10:49:24 PM
Also, I've never heard of a NAM newcomer tackling RUL2 right from the very beginning.

Indeed, it is a very rare occurrence, and very neat to see.  You're really off to a running start, isii94, so my metaphorical hat is off to you. :thumbsup:

-Alex

memo

Quote from: Tarkus on July 18, 2014, 11:13:10 PM
It was believed at that time that there needed to be a physical connection between the tiles in order to get the game to read a multi-tile network built from a composite of smaller networks (which actually rendered these early prototypes completely intolerant to slopes), though memo fortunately disproved it.  This whole discussion can actually be seen in the old RHW development thread at ST.

Really? I can't even remember that. $%Grinno$% I should browse through the old threads more often.

In the initial version of draggable GLR, the T intersection and 90 corner actually acted as starters, too, as those intersections don't exist for elevated rail. Though, it seems to have been disabled since.

GDO29Anagram

Quote from: memo on July 18, 2014, 11:43:01 PM
Quote from: Tarkus on July 18, 2014, 11:13:10 PM
It was believed at that time that there needed to be a physical connection between the tiles in order to get the game to read a multi-tile network built from a composite of smaller networks (which actually rendered these early prototypes completely intolerant to slopes), though memo fortunately disproved it.  This whole discussion can actually be seen in the old RHW development thread at ST.

Really? I can't even remember that. $%Grinno$% I should browse through the old threads more often.

Page 47. http://community.simtropolis.com/topic/4381-real-highway-rhw-development-and-support/page-47
<INACTIVE>
-----
Simtropolis | YouTube | MLP Forums

isii94

Quote from: APSMS on July 18, 2014, 10:24:11 PM
So, if I understand correctly, you've created a texture override using INRULs (?) and basically created a new kind of pseudo express network with express lines in the middle and branch/local lines on the side?!?

Well, it's not INRUL based but RUL2. And yes, that's what I'm creating. Maybe I'll make switches automatically to be STR (DTR from one side would be kind of pointless).

Quote from: GDO29Anagram on July 18, 2014, 10:49:24 PM
There are ways to implement these in-game, using either puzzle pieces (not recommended long-term, but worth trying) or using INRUL patterns; thing is, one method has a tutorial and the other does not. However, there'd be a problem with implementing the 45-degree curve: RealRailway disables shared-tile overlapping Dual Track Rail, and you've designed it to use a shared-tile diagonal, so you may wanna rethink that.

So that would mean defining a texture for 1,3,1,3 (or is it 3,1,3,1?) flags again in the INRUL and when this texture occurs, automatically overriding the adjacent diagonals using RUL 2? (I don't know yet, though, how dragging multiple adjacent shared-tile diagonals could be prevented, RUL2 with a 0,0,0,0,0,0 override I suppose?)
MD coming soon...

GDO29Anagram

Quote from: isii94 on July 19, 2014, 04:11:39 AM
(I don't know yet, though, how dragging multiple adjacent shared-tile diagonals could be prevented, RUL2 with a 0,0,0,0,0,0 override I suppose?)

Probably done by removing the INRUL entries entirely. After all, RRW uses a completely rewritten set of INRULs, so who knows what got removed?
<INACTIVE>
-----
Simtropolis | YouTube | MLP Forums

isii94

#772
Progress of today...

MD coming soon...

cmdp123789

I have a question... could this method be applied to roads?

isii94

#774
Which method? Do you mean shared-tile diagonals or T intersections as starters?
MD coming soon...

cmdp123789

yup.. the shared tile.. also the intersection.. just everything lol

GDO29Anagram

Quote from: cmdp123789 on July 19, 2014, 07:53:25 PM
yup.. the shared tile.. also the intersection.. just everything lol

Shared-tile's already mostly possible with a lot non-rail networks already, primarily Road and One Way Road. However, it's a somewhat awkward way of implementing an override network because of how generally awkward its network bends are (you know, how you go from orthogonal to diagonal?), and, in a way, how generally awkward it is to intersect with other networks, even with itself. This doesn't mean it's completely useless; two NWM networks actually use shared-tile diagonals, though the implementation for both could be changed to something else in future developments.

Also, using a T-intersection to induce an override for an override network is just too impractical; you'd be getting networks you don't want in all of the wrong places. This is why we use starters: to get the network you want in all the right places.
<INACTIVE>
-----
Simtropolis | YouTube | MLP Forums

eggman121

Very nice work Isabella  :thumbsup: . I'm quite impressed that you have been able to dive into RUL2 code so quickly. The only suggestion I could make about the texture is that the rails should be at equidistant spacing at 4.5m from the centre of the track.

Since I'm making some catenaries for the RRW I would be delighted to make some poles and wires for your work once you have finalised the design.

I'm looking forward to seeing more. Keep it up, you are doing a  fantastic job.   $%Grinno$%

-eggman121

Tarkus

Quote from: GDO29Anagram on July 19, 2014, 08:03:57 PM
Also, using a T-intersection to induce an override for an override network is just too impractical; you'd be getting networks you don't want in all of the wrong places. This is why we use starters: to get the network you want in all the right places.

In the case of Rail, a setup like two Ts going together like that is virtually useless from a functional perspective with the default setup for that network.  Traffic can't actually use it, and you'd never see a railroad do that in real life.  However, with a Road network of some sort, someone might actually build an intersection like that, which complicates things on that front.  Unless, of course, we simply tell those people "no" to building intersections of that sort.

-Alex

isii94

Quote from: eggman121 on July 19, 2014, 09:41:04 PM
Very nice work Isabella  :thumbsup: . I'm quite impressed that you have been able to dive into RUL2 code so quickly. The only suggestion I could make about the texture is that the rails should be at equidistant spacing at 4.5m from the centre of the track.

Since I'm making some catenaries for the RRW I would be delighted to make some poles and wires for your work once you have finalised the design.

I'm looking forward to seeing more. Keep it up, you are doing a  fantastic job.   $%Grinno$%

-eggman121

Thanks  :) (INRUL was actually harder to understand than RUL2...)

The distance between the central rails is in fact 4.5m. There are some reasons why I'd actually like to keep the distance between the fast and slow tracks greater than 4.5m:

  • It will be easier to create switch textures as existing STR textures can be reused
  • There's enough space for signalling the fast tracks without automata cutting through the models
  • It looks less like a waste of space at the edge of the tile $%Grinno$%
MD coming soon...