Hello AC Team,
During the past few weeks I have been working on making an editor for the effect dir (in maltab, so unfortunately it is not something easy to use). I can however now fairly easy create new effects, or edit existing effects. One of the things I think is possible now is to add new airplane automata, perhaps even edit the take off and landing properties...
Is this something that would be of interest to you? If so, I am going to need some help. A good starting point for me would be full 3d models of airplanes (s3d) and skins to be included. Additionally, maybe some of you have thought about editing landing or take off motion properties. I am not sure the current airplanes have sounds attached to them, but that would be another possibilities I could explore.
Let me know what you think...
Stupid question, we have always been limited with train skins, is this method work for adding new ones???
Same question as Girafe!!that would be great!
I think it will also work for trains... But it is just my initial guess... I need to extend my matlab scripts for this... And I am not sure if I need to create an all new effect, or override the existing one. Anyway, at this moment I am optimistic.
A few strange findings. While studying the effect dir, I find pointers that link planes that take off the all kinds of different effects, sounds, but also a mild earthquake effect. I have never ever observed these during planes taking of in the game. So I am wondering... Has anybody ever seen these things in game?
Mild earthquake effects?? the only thing I can think of that might be for is the thud created when a plane touches down, other than that I can't really imagine what it might be for.
Also, best of luck with your effects.dir exploration.
Xander
Very exciting project Alex! Good luck and I'll be following closely :thumbsup:
For the trains according to what I know the real Automatos transit are not controlled by EFFdir with the exception of accidents, as well as the paths followed that are determined in the respective LUA scripts (Follow Road or Follow Rail).
The idea of new automata aereos could be executable but i think goes beyond to create a new ID with a new S3D as you will need also the edition of Effdir in more than one section.
As a more complicated example see the powered propeller that has more of a S3D animation beyond the shadow and the
Track condensation.
But I cheer for the continuing of work for we can have more ease of editing EFFdir.
NCGAIO, you are correct, at least for the planes, that it is complicated. The problem is that the base runway effect points to other effects which point to other effects in the effdir. Overriding an effect turns out to be impossible (I tried).
So the only options is to copy all of those effects and give them new names and make sure all references to these new names are correct (effects are not identified by instance IDs but by string names instead :S) and it seems the game only looks for instnaces in a single effdir file, which makes this all the more challenging :(
I now have a script to also append two or more single effects that I isolated with my previous matlab script. What i need to do now is manually edit all strings so they are updated with the new names. Then hopefully i will have a completely new effdir that contains all effects of the large runway. If that turns out to work in the game, i,ll try to add planes.
For the trains, i am not sure yet. There is a section in the effect dir that takes care of random picks. Not sure however if that is used for the trains. So indeed i may have been a bit overenthusiastic as far as the trains are concerned...
Orher then that i keep finding references to sounds i have never heard during gameplay, perhaps these are conditional, and controled by the many parametrs is the effdir for which it is not clear what they mean. But there are also a bunchof references to sound IIDs that simply don't exist. Let's see what happens if i point them to existing sound files... Perhaps we get laughing planes :D
Eureka! It works.
Still much work needed. But I have created 3 all new planes and an entire new runway effect. Sofar only implemented the planes that are generated high in the sky (see picture), but this should just as well work for ascending and descending planes.
The files are a bit messy still.. but if you want to try I have attached the prelim version . Just unzip in the plugins folder and create a lot and put the effect on it (called jenxlargerunway). Plop the lot in the game and zoom out.
Next thing to do is write a small script specifically for adding multiple planes to my all new effdir. What I can do is just add 50 similar s3d models or so, which can then be reskinned or remodelled afterwards, without having to edit the effdir anymore.
-alex
this is turning really interesting :thumbsup:
it'd be awesome to see planes landing with a more natural approach slope than maxis automata do..
keep up with your great job :thumbsup:
mauricio.
Awesome!! &dance :thumbsup:
Awesome work Alex!
I'll have to start working on that program again.
Quote from: Lowkee33 on November 17, 2012, 08:13:03 AM
Awesome work Alex!
I'll have to start working on that program again.
Lowkee! Good to see you back. I have made tremendous progress last week. My matlab scripts allow me to isolate effects from the main effdir. I have created new animals, new flashlights (for the eiffel tower) and last few days new planes. (I can share those scripts by the way... But they are messy, without comments and over the past days I have kept improving on them).
A bit more about the airplanes. I can now add without much work as many planes as I want. There is a caveat though (which can be solved). It is no problem at all to add multiples of the same two 3ds models that are already in the game (707 and 767). I can also add new models a380 for example, but.... The difficulty would be the additions of theflashlights, smoke trails and shadows. The effect dir contains parameters (offset coordinates) to compose the plane model, smoke and light models.. These al have to be tined for a new model that has different dimenions. It can be done however. I need low poly skinned 3ds models though...
Additionally, i can now control the approach slope, and also how long the plane "rolls out" (don't know the appropriate english term here). This off course requires longer runways... So I really need some input from AC team members ;-) ... Anyone...
Once i have the a380, it may even be possible to differentiate in approach properties between planes... We all know the 380 needs longer runways in real life... So why not in sc4.
The one thing that has been unsuccesfull up to now, is to get the sound to work. The original maxis effdir for the runways and planes already contain indices pointing to TRK files. However, they don't play (only if I completely zoom out, i can here some faint airplane sounds from the TRK files, not at closer zoom levels though :( ....
Keep you posted, alex
Pfff.. like i was saying I can edit the runway approach... but how is another thing. I cannot figure out the coordinate for the movement as defined in section 1 of the effect dir... 3 entries of x1,z1,y1,x2,z2,y2 coordinates and a seq_nr.... Lowkee/NCGAIO or anyone else.. any clue?
I don't think I can help with any of the actual parameters of an effect. The only thing I can think of in Section 1 would be to make a negative value for the z-force (or perhaps y, but I don't see any other effects with a y force).
I don't know how your planes are moving, is this just a behavior you copied from the existing planes? Do other planes land? It may be tough to get something to land, as I'm not sure how we would figure out when the plane "hits" the ground. Is the act of the plane taking off a different effect as from when it is flying around?
Actually, the planes land and take off perfectly well if I just leave it at the copied parameters. However, no i got the hang of modding i was trying to tune the movement a bit. If if change the coord movement system coordinates the ascend and descending indeed changes... However, if have no idea how to get the changes to go the way i want. I don't understand why for each rep in the coordinate system there are 2 coordinates x1z1y1 and x2y2z2... And i don't understand the meaning of the sequence numbers in the coordinate system. I even plotted the coordinates... But it just doesn't make sence..
Ah.. Maybe leave if for a few days...
Lowkee, how about sounds.. Any ideas on that? I know if i include a reference to section 9 in section 12 the effect should have sounds.. Fr planes it doesn't seem to work however... Maybe i am missign something.
Smethng else (may have asked this before :P) are there any low poly s3d models with skins available for other types of planes... Airbus, a380, 747... Etc..
I have no idea about sounds. Remember with those pigeons, at first the sound was very loud and everywhere. I changed it back to the original value and then it was too quiet, but at least it could only be heard close to the plop site.
I've got no idea about any of it really. I was focusing on making a program to compare/edit values to see what could be learned from them.
Changing a z-coordinate may raise the effect, but such a thing, "being raised", is hard to see from the game perspective.
Hmm, just realized this is in the AC thread... There might be some free plane models on the internet that you could trim down the poly count?
Quote from: Lowkee33 on November 17, 2012, 02:37:29 PM
There might be some free plane models on the internet that you could trim down the poly count?
http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/
& if I am right on the pri-lex there are planes 3D models &Thk/(
Time for an update. I am making tremendous progres.. only held back my my fear to make mistakes and having to start all over again.
I have created new effect dirs for complete new runways that allow for a predefined number of new plane models to be included and for each model a predefined number of skins that are randomly selected by the game. Next to a runway for the large planes, I have created a seperate runway for jumbo planes, ie the A380 (and a placeholder for another jumbo plane), which requires an extra long runway. (BTW a 747 model will be included along the regular large planes). A third runway is a mixed one, where both large and jumbo planes can land and take off.
I might finish the runway 'controllers' sooner then expected and upload for testing. The biggest amount of work will be actually to created an tune the models. Currently I am using 4 same base models as 'placeholder' and very quick and dirty skins. All 3ds plane models from the net have way to many polys for the game to handle. And texture unwrapping is not a fun thing to do. Anyway, this can be release already before all models and skins are ready. Models and skins can just be overriden as long as the override dat files are loader later.
The coordinate system is still driving me crazy though. I now the parameters I need to change to alter approach path etc, but the results are highly unpredictable... requiring re-starting the game each time after changing a parameter ...
By the way.. I am using ssome models from the stex/lex amongst other some by voltaire. I'll ask for permission and give full recognition before I will upload off course.
-Alex
Amazing progress Alex &apls &apls &apls
Just awesome &apls &apls Now I'm glad I've waited to build an airport until now ;D
()stsfd() &apls &apls Great job ... is fantastic to see the patience and dedication that you had in to experience the data even with so thing much missing in Effdir
Congratulations your perseverance to complete work ... ( Twinge of jealousy :'( )
One little tip ... work on animation sometimes does not have the widespread recognition due to having no direct influence on the game. ( Eg: Sims not fly over the cities ) beyond all known issues to run on some conditions.
So do not get discouraged (like me) if by chance you do not have the expected impact about the projects. New things are always welcome and help to keep the game alive.
Thanks guys! NCGAIO thank you for your kind words. I won't worry too much by people that don't like it, and focus on those that are enthusiastic! Besides, I like puzzle solving. And I just cracked another nut... I now know how to control the planes coordinate system. This means I have full control of flight path. Even cooler: i can also make the planes taxi on the runway. The problem of the latter is that it will be a hard coded path in the effdir... With no way to follow the runways as laid out in the game... Not quite sure how to handle this...
Anyway.. Much fine tuning needed...
Other cool things: I have slight increased size and brightness of the planes port lights etc... Works much better now with dark night mods etc.
-alex
QuoteWith no way to follow the runways as laid out in the game... Not quite sure how to handle this...
This is the sort of thing I have been thinking about. We
should be able to make attractors and repulsers for these effects (place a soccer field and watch, the players are attracted to the ball, which is repulsed by the players). I've been thinking about heavy machinery that actually moves around a Lot with a purpose.
Lowkee... what a fantastic idea!... it would open up so much possibilities! I already feel the urge tp start to explore :D
Anyway here is a quick vid from the planes... look at planes landing on the green strips for the altered paths (only at the end of the landing).
http://youtu.be/PngKO5M-j70
Oh..just thinking diagonal landing certainly belongs to the possibilities... now I have the paths undercontrol it is not a problem. Just a lot of work :(
Mmmm.. not sure if AC team place was the best location for these posts... I never expected to get this far when I started... Any ideas for a better location.. or just leave it here?
-Alex
I think that while in developing you could keep him here. Certainly AC would be more appropriate to put the mods finalized and disseminated as appropriate..
If you think of considering the path of taxiing aircraft to the terminal for a landing or takeoff, then I see no other way to do it except a that you have quoted.
Follow paths would only be possible using a network existing in game and riding an illusion as the used for the CAN-AM or paths created for parts as I would do for a horserace. Link (https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Hco6SWT-GrQ/TxPgY4Zb_ZI/AAAAAAAABN4/4kfWZ6Q-C2o/s320/hipodromo.gif)
- - www.youtube.com/watch (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=UZN_b_cwnSw)
In this case as the airport runways are always away from other networks rarely occur the presence of other automatons beyond those belonging to the group created to use them.
Here a more futuristic model by Srainy to more visual impact in tests and developments
"$Deal"$ - Airbus Concept Plane (http://simcity.cn/thread-114350-1-1.html)
The attractors and repellers work on already attracted some attention previously as seen here
"$Deal"$ - How to make automata follow routes? By blockers or attractors? (http://sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=12362.msg362472#msg362472)
Relevant information is also on the Wiki Devotion ..
"$Deal"$ - http://www.wiki.sc4devotion.com/index.php?title=LUAObject (http://www.wiki.sc4devotion.com/index.php?title=LUAObject)
I have uploaded a version of the Air Traffic Controller mod for scrutineering to the private lex. On my laptop all seems to work fine but I really need some input on how to continue and improve (I am really exhausted by this... spend way too many time on this :P). I hope also to get some feedback from advanced modders, it would really be appreciated, and full recognition will be given once I upload off course...
BTW: I temporarily used Sainry's fantastic plane models and send him a pm to ask for permission to include his plane models in this mod (and give him proper recognition off course). I don't have permission yet.. but think it is okay to upload to private lex for testing.
Note the mod is not ready. I need to include many placeholders for additional planes that can then be added later on. It's a lot of repetitious work but otherwise won't effect the mod.
-Alex
http://sc4devotion.com/bsclex/lex_filedesc.php?lotGET=1228
Guys, I have a bit of an issue. As mentioned I need to include plane models in my 'air traffic controller' mod. And I used Srainy's models from the STEX. I did contact him to ask if I could use his models and he replied. The problem is he hardly speaks any English and communication is extremely difficult... At this moment I couldn't make out if he understood my question, or that in his response he agreed for me to use the models.
I need some suggestions on how to progress...
Sainry is Chinese right? I just PMed a Chinese friend on site asking if he might be able to lend a hand :thumbsup:
Thx Noa!
&idea It's easier to talk to FANTA (http://simcity.cn/space-uid-9708.html) that did the upload of the model that I mentioned up above in site SCcn.
Already swapped posting in English that he understood perfectly and can help you with Sainry... besides that he also have a excellent turboprop model for replacement. - LINK (http://simcity.cn/viewthread.php?tid=100849&extra=&page=1)
()sad() It's a shame not to know more about the mod as this only in private Lex.
Anyway ... good luck with the launch ()stsfd()
I haven't had a chance to get in-game, but it looks like you did some serious work with the effect dir.
&apls
this looks amazing. after so many years there are still great things to be found.
this will make a lot of airplane (and simcity) fans very, very happy. &apls
excellent work xannepan!
Quote from: NCGAIO on November 24, 2012, 03:45:46 PM
&idea It's easier to talk to FANTA (http://simcity.cn/space-uid-9708.html) that did the upload of the model that I mentioned up above in site SCcn.
Already swapped posting in English that he understood perfectly and can help you with Sainry... besides that he also have a excellent turboprop model for replacement. - LINK (http://simcity.cn/viewthread.php?tid=100849&extra=&page=1)
()sad() It's a shame not to know more about the mod as this only in private Lex.
Anyway ... good luck with the launch ()stsfd()
This idea is great, since FANTA is very close to Sainry.
And let's wait and see if I can offer some help too. :)
Quote from: NCGAIO on November 24, 2012, 03:45:46 PM
()sad() It's a shame not to know more about the mod as this only in private Lex.
Anyway ... good luck with the launch ()stsfd()
I'll send you a PM with a wetransfer link. The more feedback I can get the better.
Same goes for contacting sainry and hopefully get his permission. Any help I can get there is very much appreciated. Without his permission it will take much longer before this can be released.
Progress is a bit slow as I am transferring to a new laptop...and I am completely frustrated on why I can't get the sounds to work :bomb: >:( :bomb: >:(
Well .. I've posted the link above FANTA but if you have not noticed here goes again
"$Deal"$ - http://simcity.cn/space-uid-9708.html (http://simcity.cn/space-uid-9708.html)
Try contact him because both are known ScCn and nobody better to help you.
The moders there of the ScCn often get upset with the posting of their models or modifications of them here (in the West), without due acknowledgment of "fatherhood".
Therefore it is easier to contact with Fanta explaining the reasons for annexation of the model instead of citing it as dependency and let him explain to Sainry.
If you try and do not have sucess then maybe I can try to post it also ok!
Found out something about the sounds. Apparently they only play if you zoom out, albeit very faint. Perhaps there is a property (HLS file, TLO file?)that defines the zoom levels at which sounds play. If there is anybody that is aware of such property pls let me know. Otherwise I'd have to do some boring exploration work myself...
I have made a start with diagonal runways. The easiest way to go is probably to copy what I have right now, give it another effect name and IID and another instance for the effectdir. I'm working on a script to calculate the coordinates for the flight paths. If that works fractionated angle flight paths shouldn't be a problem either. The only thing I cannot seem to control in a completely predictable way is the speed by which the planes travel between defined coordinate points. Speed is controlled by at least a combination of sequence numbers and effect duration. But It still requires to much trial and error to get that right for my taste :(
And there is still that mysterious pointer to the earth quake properties which has me puzzled...
FYI: I have posted an updated version of the mod on the private lex.
Another update has been posted to the private lex. I now have diagonal and fractioned angle flight paths included. There is an issue however with the landing part for diagonal and fractioned angle. The landing actually is composed out of two parts, a descend path and a landing path. The latter controls how planes move after touch down. Unfortunately, for diagonal and fractioned angles this part doesn't show. After many days of trial and error I have no clue what is causing the problem.
Sigh... I hit the post button... get an idea... and yes... problem solved!
Anyway; as far as I can tell these mods are stable and work as desired. I really could use some feedback before release however, so any comments would be much appreciated.
Alex
Great work Alex -- for years this was the biggest unsolved issue for SC4 aircraft modding, and you've fixed it in a couple of weeks! Amazing work.
Sorry, I haven't logged in for awhile, due to being away from home. But I'd like to help in anyway possible, now that I'm back. Since I'm primarily an aircraft modelmaker now, that's how I can be the most help: I've got gmax scenes for every size of aircraft, from 1-seat glider to A380.
I'll give the mod a try and post later with feedback :thumbsup:
A few observations on this promising mod --
- Having open slots built into this is a great design choice, the aircraft lineup can be customized by simple s3d substitution :)
- all 5 lots seem to function normally except if I bulldoze something nearby: then airplanes taxi abnormally or stop appearing altogether. Quitting to the region and reloading the city fixes it.
- One 'ghost aircraft' appears regularly, in both the runway and region view (enroute) animations. Reader loads all the s3d's correctly, so I'm not sure what's causing it.
(https://www.sc4devotion.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8500%2F8255259338_e0a5f2436b.jpg&hash=677672feb7f6a90cca4c1498b7f347589cfdd62b)
(nav lights, contrails, and shadow are ok... but no aircraft)
The one thing I'd suggest changing, is the overall speed of both the runway and enroute automata. Maxis left this completely the opposite of what it should be - the runway speeds are too fast, and the enroute too slow. From post #37 I see that changing the speed is difficult to control; but is there an easy way to just increase the total duration, without needing to change the time between individual points?
Related question - is it possible to modify the overall distance covered by the runway animation? I'd like to experiment with having these planes use long custom runways.
Thanks Voltaire, for testing. I can really use your help for further completion and this is a good start.
The ghost plane is probably a faulty reference to an ID in the effect dir itself. It shouldn't be to hard to solve that. The bulldozing issue is new to me... I don't think I can solve it. Have you tried if it also occurs with the maxis runways?
I am glad you figured out how to deal with the s3d substitution. There is one caveat. The effect dir "adds" nav lights and contrails to the model, and to make it look ok the effect dir needs the exact coordinates of the wingtips etc. where those lights should be placed. This cannot be overriden. So if you substitute a s3d by a model with completely different dimensions, it won't work. The best way to deal with is is to only substitute the FSH skins.
However, in this phase, if you have models you'd like to add; I am willing to do so. It will take some time, as it is a lot off boring work prone to errors and frustration. Personally I would like to see some additional larger propeller planes :)
About the paths and speed.This is another area of frustration. Maybe you have notices that the a380 uses a longer runway path. It's not free from errors though: during ascend for a moment it appears the plane movement freezes for a second or so. I have no idea how to solve if.. Another bug in the diagonal take-off path; planes make a strange movement which I cannot understand given the coordinates I have put in.
Quote from: xannepan on December 09, 2012, 03:14:45 AM
The bulldozing issue is new to me... I don't think I can solve it. Have you tried if it also occurs with the maxis runways?
You're probably right, I'll test this with the regular Maxis airports to confirm. Having so many effect props stacked on the test lots might be affecting the behavior as well.
Quote from: xannepan on December 09, 2012, 03:14:45 AM
So if you substitute a s3d by a model with completely different dimensions, it won't work. The best way to deal with is is to only substitute the FSH skins.
This is what stopped me from modding more aircraft automata (5 years ago). I was trying to substitute a full-scale DC-8 in place of the maxis 707, but no matter what I'd do the shadows and nav lights stayed put.
Which leads me to another observation: This mod changes runway and enroute automata, but there's a third style to consider: aircraft sitting at the gate. Without them, players will probably consider this mod incomplete... because all the Maxis aircraft were done in all 3 styles. Could srainy's s3d models be packaged similar to the Maxis parked aircraft effects?
Quote from: xannepan on December 09, 2012, 03:14:45 AM
However, in this phase, if you have models you'd like to add; I am willing to do so. It will take some time, as it is a lot off boring work prone to errors and frustration. Personally I would like to see some additional larger propeller planes :)
That's perfect, I've been wanting to make some 1950's designs like the Boeing 377, Bristol Britannia, and Lockheed Constellation. The catch is, BAT/gmax does not save in s3d format; so I need to learn a new program (Blender), which apparently does save s3d files. There may be some useful models online, I'll check around and see.
Quote from: xannepan on December 09, 2012, 03:14:45 AM
Another bug in the diagonal take-off path; planes make a strange movement which I cannot understand given the coordinates I have put in.
I noticed none of the test lots has the standard runway tags (
Tag_1x1x3_Runway---Gnome). All the Maxis runways are tagged (one tag at each end). Through experience I know that user-drivable aircraft definitely use those tags to find where the runway is -- they'll even use a diagonal runway flawlessly if its ends are tagged. I realize these are non-drivable automata here, but they move about in essentially the same manner during approach and landing; so perhaps the tags will help.
Hi Voltaire... just a quick first response...
Quote from: Voltaire on December 12, 2012, 12:37:57 PM
Which leads me to another observation: This mod changes runway and enroute automata, but there's a third style to consider: aircraft sitting at the gate. Without them, players will probably consider this mod incomplete... because all the Maxis aircraft were done in all 3 styles. Could srainy's s3d models be packaged similar to the Maxis parked aircraft effects?
Yes, it's just a lot off boring error prone work :(
Quote from: Voltaire on December 12, 2012, 12:37:57 PM
That's perfect, I've been wanting to make some 1950's designs like the Boeing 377, Bristol Britannia, and Lockheed Constellation. The catch is, BAT/gmax does not save in s3d format; so I need to learn a new program (Blender), which apparently does save s3d files. There may be some useful models online, I'll check around and see.
There is a script that is used by the NAM team which allows export as '3ds file'... A bit complicated to explain how it works exactly... so I'll get back to this once I have more time. Let me try to dig up the script first...
If refers to the script to export Gmax in full 3d model then this explained on this page
Making Models for Transit Networks: Some General Specifications (http://sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=3917.msg122193#msg122193)
Script - BuildingMill.zip (http://sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3917.0;attach=2685)
Yes, NCGAIO that is the one! Thank you.
Voltaire: I have another request. I have created a BAT building model from Dulles Airport. The model and lot are complete, but sofar I have created a landmark, just for testing. I have no idea how I can create a functional airport out of it. Can you help me do that? If so, I can post everyhting on the BSC lex.
Now Dulles is as good as done, I'll play a bit more with the airplane (and animal) effects. Let's see if I can fine tune the landing and take off paths and address the speed issue as you have mentioned.
-Alex
I got the sounds to work... well sort of. Currently landing planes make firework sounds lol. Anyway.. having sounds when planes take off really adds to the realistic city experience imo.
Seems that the sounds issue is only partly a problem of the effdir. But more annoying is that some sound files seem to play and some don't play at all... I'm still relying more on intuition then on a structured approach.
I also wonder if it has nothing to do with support of sound cards... I hope not, in that case all my efforts are of no value at all (except for my current laptop :P)
Glad to see that things are progressing here :thumbsup: I think the passengers may be a bit frightened by the landing sounds at the moment though :D
Allright, version 7 posted on the BSC lex. Sounds are included, still some fine tuning to do. Details in readme :)
Another brief update. I spend some time again in trying to adjust the coordinates. I have learned that I have been completely thrown off balance by the maxis entries for the existing runways. They just don't make sense and are inconsistent with the structure the system seems to impose... The fact that they seem to work is a bit puzzling though. Anyway, once I decided to ignore the maxis entries and use common sense, the results are at least reproducible.
The only thing that is still difficult is tuning every parameter to get realistic results. I want to make longer take off and landing paths with reduced airplane speed....
I am learning a lot from playing with the effdir. Tons of new ideas... But so little time :(
Thanks NGCAIO for the script, that will save some time!
Now I just need to make some low-poly-count planes. To begin with, my old DC-7C model can be reused but I want to scale it properly first (easily done with Excel). Wingspan of late-build DC-7's was about the same as today's Boeing 757.
Quote from: xannepan on December 15, 2012, 03:39:26 AM
Voltaire: I have another request. I have created a BAT building model from Dulles Airport. The model and lot are complete, but sofar I have created a landmark, just for testing. I have no idea how I can create a functional airport out of it. Can you help me do that? If so, I can post everyhting on the BSC lex.
Saarinen's main terminal? That's a real work of art, a very welcome addition to SC4!
I can try modding the lot, however, Tage is the real expert. He modded and released all the X-Ports, including my prefab airport set.
Due to the special nature of functional ports, all of them must be collected together into one package. So we're taking about an update to AC Functional Airports ;D I was planning to ask Tage for an update release early next year, to add more stages in the prefab airports. Perhaps we can combine our projects into the same update?
Quote from: xannepan on December 18, 2012, 12:40:56 AM
Tons of new ideas... But so little time :(
^^This, a thousand times. I've got many ideas for Lots and BATs, notes on how to get them done, but no time to make them.
I'll try out version 7 soon; great to see the kinks in the plane movement can be worked out :thumbsup:
Quote from: Voltaire on December 18, 2012, 11:49:45 AM
Now I just need to make some low-poly-count planes. To begin with, my old DC-7C model can be reused but I want to scale it properly first (easily done with Excel). Wingspan of late-build DC-7's was about the same as today's Boeing 757.
You can save a lot of time working (EXCELL) using the Cogeo's tool for rescaling your model and see the result in the game before going to BAT.
SC4 Model Tweaker (V3.00) (http://sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=7553.msg426171#msg426171)
A note on the
effect does not appear as desired.This is one of the problems for the use of animations in Effedir. This even included in game documentation that the use of effects must be parsimonious because its excess and any peculiar conditions of the Map of the game can lead to erratic effect. eg: Mods of Gizmo weather (clouds)
Yep, model tweaker will help here :)
One more thing. I assume you know how to uvw unwrap textures in max? If not, let me now, i can make a short tutorial...
(Wth uvw unwrap, you can skin the planes in max, wothout having to use the limited functionality in illives reader.)
-alex
Version 10 is on the bsc lex. Still some glitches but getting there...
Voltaire, have a look at my posts over at the BSC Board, i have posted some pictures of Dulles.
Thanks for the tip on model tweaker :thumbsup:
The good thing about Reader + Excel is that the coordinates are searchable. Would this help in anyway when it comes to entering the nav light positions? For example, the wingtips always have the largest X values; the nose would have the highest Z value, etc.
Regarding UVW Unwrap, I'm familiar enough with making them (used it on 737 and 757 winglets). So, as long as the UV coordinates are preserved during export, and I import the correct textures into Reader, it should work as modeled?
I'm having trouble with the export itself though. Even with the special BuildingMill script installed, gmax still makes standard 2.5D props. Was there something else necessary for the export to work, not mentioned in the NAM tutorial? Remove LODs, remove lighting, etc.
Quote from: xannepan on December 19, 2012, 04:59:03 AM
Voltaire, have a look at my posts over at the BSC Board, i have posted some pictures of Dulles.
I couldn't track this down, was it a separate topic, or part of a larger thread?
http://sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=2596.980
As for the export I am not sure anymore. What may also work is apply the uvw map and unwrap it (using the unwrap modifier). Next export the model as 3ds, and select preserve uvw coordinates. Then just import in the reader.
I can find back the coordinates by exporting from reader and importign again in 3ds max or gmax. I just use the cursor coordinates a the wingtips etc.
Quote from: xannepan on December 22, 2012, 11:57:50 AM
http://sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=2596.980
Oops - my mistake. Thought you meant the BSC Board website :-[ Very nice work!
Quote from: xannepan on December 22, 2012, 11:57:50 AM
Next export the model as 3ds, and select preserve uvw coordinates
This is what gmax can't do; this is why I may need to learn Blender. With gmax, the only choice in the File -> Export... menu is .P3D (Plasma) format. The BAT's Export button makes standard props, even with the modified BuildingMill script. Perhaps the script only works in BAT4max, not gmax.
Quote from: Voltaire on December 22, 2012, 12:31:24 PM
This is what gmax can't do; this is why I may need to learn Blender. With gmax, the only choice in the File -> Export... menu is .P3D (Plasma) format.
You need an intermediate format for get .3 DS from Gmax - Reasons - Model import and export (http://wiki.flightgear.org/Model_import_and_export)
One solution that works well for low Polys would be to export as MD3 and convert to .3 ds using Lithunwrap (Free). How ...
Link - export MD3 from Gmax (http://web.archive.org/web/20090418062722/http://davidhsmith.net/downloaditems/md3exp.zip)-
- Unzip and put it in /gmaxstdplugs
- When exporting the model, if it has no animation
set the fallowing frames to 0 Link - Lithunwrap ( Free ) (http://files.seriouszone.com/download.php?action=download&fileid=198&mirrorid=12&h=078e65522b71e8af66cd99a8760de175&filename=lithunwrap_setup.zip)
- Install this program and run it .
- With it you will be able convert .MD3 to 3DS, LWO, OBJ, DXF and others formats. note: is also a UV mapper
Quote from: Voltaire on December 22, 2012, 12:31:24 PM
The BAT's Export button makes standard props, even with the modified BuildingMill script. Perhaps the script only works in BAT4max, not gmax.
Maybe this can help you ... - REDLOTUS INTERCHANGE TUTORIAL (https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=abcf59db7e6fd6bb&id=ABCF59DB7E6FD6BB%21114)- note :This link is functional - search the title "Interchange Tutorial"
With doubts if the script actually works? Then check ....
- How do I render Full3D gMax Models? (http://sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=8006.msg250608#msg250608)
- Interchange Tutorial Thread (http://community.simtropolis.com/topic/2284-interchange-tutorial-thread/) -
If you prefer to use Gmax then may also be interested in these tools ..
- Simtropolis Tolls (http://community.simtropolis.com/topic/367-simtropolis-tools/page__st__90)
Both ... 3Dfull script and other tools can also be found here ....
- Bat script From interchange Tutorial (http://community.simtropolis.com/topic/18375-bat-script-from-interchange-tutorial/#entry519944)
EDIT: Link to Folder 4shared with many plane models - ttp://www.4shared.com/folder/U8_KWpc8/_online.html (http://www.4shared.com/folder/U8_KWpc8/_online.html)
Hope this helps to continue. :thumbsup:
Quote from: NCGAIO on December 22, 2012, 01:49:54 PM
Maybe this can help you ... - REDLOTUS INTERCHANGE TUTORIAL (https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=abcf59db7e6fd6bb&id=ABCF59DB7E6FD6BB%21114)- note :This link is functional - search the title "Interchange Tutorial"
This tutorial is the only one that described customized (skintight) LODs necessary for the modified BuildingMill to function. This may well be the missing piece of my puzzle, thanks! I'll try it out this weekend.
Also, I've successfully exported .OBJ from gmax and it seems to retain the uv coordinates and materials ;D I'll use Lithunwrap with both the OBJ and True3d render... and see which route is best.
Glad to see you are making progress! Keep it up :-)
Quote from: xannepan on January 09, 2013, 02:16:15 AM
I have decided to release soon as a beta version, otherwise I am affraid RL will become too busy and I won't release at all.
The same for this mod (I'm hoping yes! :thumbsup: ) ... I believe that even with the minor problems that already was cited this should also be highly sought!
Toc. Toc. Toc. ... someone at home? &mmm
anything new?... maybe a beta launch! :)
Just a few known issues that I know how to solve now.... And then a beta indeed. Hopefully within a week.
My apologies for taking so much time away. There have been issues to deal with... but I'm back for now. Will it still be possible to contribute a new aircraft to the project?
This Super Constellation's mesh & uv mapping are complete and it's been modded into a working S3D:
(https://www.sc4devotion.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8238%2F8453230971_38fdf35b76.jpg&hash=842c60b28bf3b3c36ea5aa7701975279d93ab45e)
These textures are just placeholders for purposes of uv mapping, I'll need about a week to complete the final set.
Great to see you back! Just send me a dat file ith the model and the fsh, and I'll make sure I add it, even with the prelim texture is okay. Texture replacement can be done afterwards.
Great model by the way!
Hey Xannepan - I am enjoying your new modds! Looking forward to the beta of this modd! Thank you for sharing your awesome works.
Breitling!!!
ZIP with placeholder textures attached. Please note that unlike the Maxis-made planes, this one includes the propeller hubs (Spinners). I hope the prop effect can be positioned on the back of the spinner, just barely in front of the engine itself.
Something I noticed is that SimCity_2.dat contains textures for the ground shadow and propellers. I would like to customize these aspects of the aircraft, if possible. There's nowhere in the aircraft s3d to specify the TGI of prop and shadow textures... are they called by the effect scripts?
Quote from: Voltaire on February 09, 2013, 04:02:23 AM
I would like to customize these aspects of the aircraft, if possible. There's nowhere in the aircraft s3d to specify the TGI of prop and shadow textures... are they called by the effect scripts?
The model of propeller is positioned over the aircraft by effect but this is a S3D which can be modified.
The TGI to animation propeller is - 5AD0E817-BADB57F1-0E160000 and the static is xx -xx - 0E150000
I think with Cogeo tool you will be able to modify and add it to airplane model if desired. :thumbsup:
I will have a look at the model asap... just want to finish some animal stuff I am working on first.
Anyway: I will create a placeholder for you to create a shadow texture.
I will see what I can do with the propellers, shouldn't be a problem. Both properties are indeed controlled by the effect dir.
Quote from: xannepan on February 11, 2013, 10:44:12 AM
I will see what I can do with the propellers, shouldn't be a problem. Both properties are indeed controlled by the effect dir.
:) Well .. not entirely. Part of the animations is referenced in section RGP of the S3D and some are linked to the Effdir by fx_ # # _name also for positioning in the model .
But as such is not part of the edition in Reader only can be modified in hex. Maybe the case may be to make a script for that too.
Alex .. if you're still working on this came across something that may be interfering with the results of experiments with route of the models.
Some conditions for the flight. are set out in Lua file - FFD7FB99 in "automata_group.planes." :)
Updated model with first complete textures attached :satisfied:
(https://www.sc4devotion.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8103%2F8500331549_1f284bcd95_b.jpg&hash=0333427a093c85f3664c0e621057efdce75276eb)
Took 2 weeks instead of one, but polished metal is difficult to carry off without a lot of trial-and error!
This copy of the s3d has been done as a classic replacement mod, replacing the Maxis 4-prop, for easy testing.
A change in the model's overall scale has been necessary -- I'm sorry if this causes extra work setting the effect coordinates. Before today I'd been testing the aircraft in isolation, without BAT aircraft nearby, so couldn't see the problem. The attached model was uniformly scaled up by 24.307%, and raised off the ground by 3.0 meters.
Since the last upload, the uv coordinates have had small adjustments, in order to get 100% alignment between the textures and make all 5 cockpit windows possible.
Nice textures... I'll see if I can manage to get it in the effect dir this week.
To avoid wasting time 'looking for here is a tip, the animation of helices is "fireplaneprop" and stationary in "fireplanepropstill".
Good luck with the repositioning if necessary! :)
So I managed to merge it into the directory, posutioning lights and props was quite easy. The plane looks really good in the game. However, at this moment while take off off works fine, there is a serious bug in landing (landing effect doesn't show up for any plane anymore). I have spend the last few days looking for a solution but without succes.. So it's going to take a bitlonger then expected.... :(
Alex
This is a problem even for the original use of the isolated effect. I remember that while "llarge_runway_takeoff" works whenever is triggered the "large_runway_landing" is random and sometimes one realizes planes entering through the texture of the ground plane. :(
The most interesting is that for use in the combined "runwayXXX" seems to work better. %confuso
Regarding the placement of the effects, if I mistake not the call to the helices is made in the section RGP of model, so you can check in effdir and try to use the "plane_midpropXXX" to put it in more easily. :)
Nope. I fixed the original Maxis bug, and with a prvious version landing worked perfectly well. This is really another bug... I am just overlooking something small...
Placement is no problem at all, it is controlled by xyz coordinates is section 12, that's all.
Okay I found the problem. I accidentally copied part off the maxis runway effect in my traffic controller, thereby duplicating the maxis bug.
It works fine now. It just needs some fine tuning before I can upload.
Well .. "
Nope" then was not so "
Nope". not it? :) :)
%confuso Doubts ... the call to the helices is made by the model? If are in that part of the section in effdir stay this positioning?
Quote from: xannepan on March 02, 2013, 02:17:40 AM
It works fine now. It just needs some fine tuning before I can upload.
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
No, the positioning of props, rotor blades, lights, condense trails etc is controlled solely by the effect dir.
Perhaps the entries in the models are for automata that are not controlled by the effect dir, bit they have no meaning for effect dir controlled planes.
Hi Voltaire, I have updated the air traffic controller to the BSC private lex to the new one.
Can you let me know if it works and what changes you'd like to see?
A completely different request. I am working on Dulles airport, and I want to tune the model to connect to jet bridges. Are the 3dsmax / gmax models for the jet bridges available somewhere, so I can create a seamless fit?
Thanks,
Alex
The latest controllers are brilliant, the aircraft motion is quite convincing -- like they're actally gliding to land, and building speed for takeoff. The sounds are perfect.
While testing, I noticed
effect_jenxrwyjumbo (0x00001003) doesn't work. The diagonal versions all work, so maybe a typo in that one exemplar?
QuoteA completely different request. I am working on Dulles airport, and I want to tune the model to connect to jet bridges
Rather than jetbridges on the Dulles terminal, I propose adding the Plane Mate (http://www.flickr.com/photos/83706652@N05/7680561974/in/photostream/) mobile lounges. They were/are a defining feature of Dulles airport (was a part of Saarinen's original plan) and are in use even today:
(https://www.sc4devotion.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8237%2F8561897628_517ced31f6_z.jpg&hash=b055d83ad397fdfaace31982ed7440426f3d5dbe)
I've actually been producing ground vehicles (http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8385/8560524647_29e2de1026_z.jpg) for some time, a Plane Mate could be made rather quickly via re-using the catering truck chassis.
How do I get access to this file...I am logged into the lex but it tells me I need to be logged in to download still :angrymore: :angrymore: :angrymore:
I am trying to download from this link
http://sc4devotion.com/bsclex/lex_filedesc.php?lotGET=1228
@rtkretz
I think you are trying to access BSC's private lot exchange... i.e. NOT the open, official lot exchange.
Quote from: xannepan on November 16, 2012, 02:25:12 PM
Eureka! It works.
Still much work needed. But I have created 3 all new planes and an entire new runway effect. Sofar only implemented the planes that are generated high in the sky (see picture), but this should just as well work for ascending and descending planes.
The files are a bit messy still.. but if you want to try I have attached the prelim version . Just unzip in the plugins folder and create a lot and put the effect on it (called jenxlargerunway). Plop the lot in the game and zoom out.
Next thing to do is write a small script specifically for adding multiple planes to my all new effdir. What I can do is just add 50 similar s3d models or so, which can then be reskinned or remodelled afterwards, without having to edit the effdir anymore.
-alex
I have this and i hate it it got ride of my other mod i have of planes landing and taking off now iam trying 2 get ride of it and its very hard to fine this is no good
Quote from: mrrockdaddy100 on October 26, 2015, 01:45:26 PM
I have this and i hate it it got ride of my other mod i have of planes landing and taking off now iam trying 2 get ride of it and its very hard to fine this is no good
Installing a mod does not get rid of other mods. SC4 works with a system of overridable parts. Automata using the same ID will replace existing automata when loaded after them.
In such instances where you prefer to use the old mods, simply remove the files for the new one. If you don't know where they are, then you also don't know where you put them. So if you don't know where the files are, that's on you not the creator. It's not really something anyone can help you with, except perhaps looking for an uninstaller if one exists?