SimFox asks for help

callagrafx · April 13, 2008, 12:56:59 AM

What can happen is the confusion over texture IDs and you get the checkerbox...BAT generates the IID for the model yes but BAT4Max creates the folders to store the BMP files which FSHMan uses to convert to FSH files, then DATCmd inserts these into the .sc4model file. This process, as it has been proved time and again, if you re-use an IID can cause all kinds of problems, which is why best practice is to re-render with a fresh ID and change the TGI in the desc.

SimFox · April 13, 2008, 06:48:56 AM

I disagree on all counts. I think this is a confused understanding of what and how Bat4Max does.
Plus it hold HUGE logical black hole - What is there to prevent BAT4Max to screw up in the case of new, fresh IDs?
Of course in a way one may say why not? If you want to create fresh IDs go ahead! On the other hand there is a danger in a approach that doesn't hold any logic and creates extra pointless work (re-working of the LOT) and creates false sense of understanding. That false taken as a truth would be used to built up farther logical constructs which ultimately also be false as they are grounded in reality.

PS I would love to see those proofs, as I may be wrong...
Checker board usually occurs when lighting rig has been discoupled with its controller. There are many ways that could happen - one when you merge and then delete rig, or rotated controller by accident.

BarbyW · April 13, 2008, 06:51:14 AM

The lot does not need to be reworked with a new model. All it needs is to change the model reference in the Building Exemplar - a 2 minute job.

callagrafx · April 13, 2008, 10:50:45 AM

Quote from: SimFox on April 13, 2008, 06:48:56 AM
I disagree on all counts. I think this is a confused understanding of what and how Bat4Max does.
Plus it hold HUGE logical black hole - What is there to prevent BAT4Max to screw up in the case of new, fresh IDs?
Of course in a way one may say why not? If you want to create fresh IDs go ahead! On the other hand there is a danger in a approach that doesn't hold any logic and creates extra pointless work (re-working of the LOT) and creates false sense of understanding. That false taken as a truth would be used to built up farther logical constructs which ultimately also be false as they are grounded in reality.

PS I would love to see those proofs, as I may be wrong...
Checker board usually occurs when lighting rig has been discoupled with its controller. There are many ways that could happen - one when you merge and then delete rig, or rotated controller by accident.

Disagree all you like, but the vast majority of us who use BAT4Max have had this problem in the past and the only workaround was a fresh set of IDs from BAT...where's the danger in creating a completely new, fresh sc4model file? None, as far as I can see...in fact it prevents a great many problems. It takes 10 secs to open up Reader and change the RKT1 as Barby says...

The ID is calculated from a number of different local hardware settings to ensure each person who renders has a completely unique IID each time. If you "re-use" an old ID, chances are the newly rendered files, when added to the sc4model will not match the IID of the model, causing checkerboxes which denote a missing texture reference. An uncoupled light rig produces a different effect, such as wrongly aligned and distorted textures.

QuoteThat false taken as a truth would be used to built up farther logical constructs which ultimately also be false as they are grounded in reality.

What on earth is that babble? Why is it whenever you are offered advice you start talking like Buddha and argue the toss? You hardly have a lot of experience with getting models into the game so I'd suggest you research a little more before dismissing what is taken as common practice by those of us who have released more than one BAT for the game.

zero7 · April 18, 2008, 12:26:36 PM

In my experience if you don't change either the filename you are saving to or the LOD you can always successfully rerender to the same model file.

If you make changes, save to a new .max file and then rerender, even with an unchanged LOD, it is likely to fail.

SimFox · April 19, 2008, 03:06:11 AM

Zero7 - of course you would successfully render it!

Bat4Max does NOTHING to all that stuff IDs and some such. It is Original BAT that is causing those problems, So naturally going and making NEW IDs would mean running pointless risk of getting bad ones when you've already got good ones.

This is precisely why I disagreed with Callagrafx. But it seems it is absolutely beyond his powers of control to not pick fights with me...

.

callagrafx · April 19, 2008, 08:10:02 PM

I never said the B4M script screwed up IDs, but the insertion of FSH files using associated programs that are integrated with B4M if the same IID is used from GMAX will cause texture errors. Your "theory" of unhinged dummies is incorrect and that's what I argued against. Although I could apply the term "unhinged dummy" elsewhere...

Try reading people's posts properly and stop with the Great God of Game Content act...you are not worthy.

As to my powers of control...

At the time of writing this I have travelled from Cardiff to London to Boston, driven from Boston to Albany, NY and spent 3 hours in the bar....my restraint and self control are superb thank you.

EDIT: OK, OK. This is right up there on the line. Sheesh, folks- let's mind our manners. -DE

BarbyW · July 30, 2008, 01:35:02 AM

SimFox, I still have the lots ready to go for the towers with the trees. Did you ever re-render the models? If so can you send them and I will change the refs in the lots.
I would love to see these on the LEX and it has been a long time since the lots were actually ready.

SimFox · August 21, 2008, 07:51:28 AM

OK after a long break here is another offering from me:
Office/retail combo corner building (inspired by one I've seen in Hangzhou, China)

South:

East

North

West

this is a 4x4 W2W block to be placed 2m away from the street. The building itself covers the entire LOT so no actual loting is needed. Of course, if someone would wish to make it let me know I can send you the model.

I think I'll make it to be CS$$. Any advise on the numbers?

Barby:
hank you for reminding me of those, I've completely forgot about them... To be honest I'm not sure if I did, but I can do it again. I have all the models and some such. I assume you mean that residential corner with a tower in the yard, right?

BarbyW · August 21, 2008, 08:57:12 AM

Those are the ones, I meant, SimFox. If you haven't re-rendered the models there is no problem with getting them to the LEX once a Readme is done. Let me know, please.
Send me the model for the new building and I will do the lot and mod it for you.

SC4BOY · August 21, 2008, 12:20:39 PM

Very nice work.. and I think you've made the maxis stuff look VERY NICE on the package.. Keep it up!

SimFox · August 22, 2008, 12:36:13 AM

SC4Boy:
I'm not sure I understand you... what do you mean "maxis stuff look VERY NICE on the package."?

Barby and anyone else who might be knowledgeable:

Is it possible to RE-NAME ready SC4Model file and keep it working properly?

toxicpiano · August 22, 2008, 01:20:08 AM

Hey simfox, are they bays for trucks/lorrys on the back of that building? because there's a red wall in the way

vester · August 22, 2008, 01:21:53 AM

There is gateway to the front of the building:

RippleJet · August 22, 2008, 01:43:27 AM

Quote from: SimFox on August 22, 2008, 12:36:13 AM
Is it possible to RE-NAME ready SC4Model file and keep it working properly?

The name of the container file (the filename seen in a windows folder) is completely insignificant, and can in theory be named freely.
However, for the sake of being consistent, I'd at least leave the three hexadecimal numbers representing the TGI of the model and the file extension (SC4Model).

SimFox · August 22, 2008, 01:55:24 AM

Toxic- that is a "kremlin/great China Wall" on the way of decadent western consumerism

And as history had proven very pointless one - full of holes

Ripple:
great... I'm thinking of making different versions (in terms of night effects) of the building and hoped that I can give Model File descriptive names. Given that such models would be mutually exclusive I didn't wanted to create entirely new set of IDs. Or am I wrong or missing something? Would such an approach work?

RippleJet · August 22, 2008, 04:04:49 AM

Quote from: SimFox on August 22, 2008, 01:55:24 AM
I'm thinking of making different versions (in terms of night effects) of the building and hoped that I can give Model File descriptive names. Given that such models would be mutually exclusive I didn't wanted to create entirely new set of IDs. Or am I wrong or missing something? Would such an approach work?

That would work perfectly, if the model files inside have the same TGI addresses!

And even if average Joe would install both model files, only the one loaded last would be used.
Thus, you might want to name them so that the default version alphabetically is loaded last.

SimFox · August 22, 2008, 04:42:54 AM

Yep, Ripple that is what I want to do!

Barby:
I, assume that you'll mod it to be CAMpatible. Right?

BarbyW · August 22, 2008, 04:46:52 AM

Of course I will, I can't do anything else these days

SimFox · August 22, 2008, 05:21:20 AM

Barby:
Great! The Model Files are ready and I could sen them to you (or send you a download link because there is 4 models there) in few minutes.

Ripple:
Am I correct in thinking that Desc file is a temporary thing and not needed (for distribution, at least) after the LOT file had been created. Also I could use same basic Desc file for all 4 different (differently named) Model files, right?