The Prop Pox!

[snorrelli]

Yes - I've tried to reproduce the Pox using the exact method you describe, and have not been able to. That's not to discourage anyone else from testing - one of the elements of research is to have different researchers run the same test multiple times and then compare results and try to identify divergences...

Part of the problem is it that it's clear removing files from the plugins without bulldozing definitely does not cause the Prop Pox every time. Many people have done this and only a few of us develop the Pox, so if it is connected to the problem at all, it is likely only a part of the equation...

[wouanagaine]

Can it be caused by updating files ?
ie you remove a file because a new one is updated, but yuo forgot to bulldoze all instance of old one ?

[snorrelli]

Not in my case... yet. The two cases I remember clearly and that were linked to these two Pox infected cities were growables that I removed because I decided I didn't like them and because they grew too much. Because they were all over the place, I did not bulldoze all instances first.

That said, because I'm paranoid that removing without bulldozing is a cause of the Prop Pox, all the recent updates and re-releases of BSC lots, including CAM-ified versions, have been giving me fits. 

[BruceAtkinson]

 I'll have to tell this in two posts, due to the size of the accompanying pictures:  In this picture we see what might be the starting of Prop-pox.  The 6x2 area surrounded by the street....however please notice the rural Tennis court.  Now, when I hovered the Question Mark over this area, it came up as the Tennis Court, no matter which way I approached the area.  When I tried to bulldoze the area, it wouldn't bulldoze, so I thought of something....(next picture/next post)
Bruce

[BruceAtkinson]

....in this picture you see the 6x2 area restored....this is what I did: I bulldozed the actual Rural Tennis Court and replaced it with the Olympic Tennis a few more blocks to the east, (out of the picture).  When I went back to the 6x2 area, the query worked fine, however still no props.  I tried to bulldoze once again, however that did not work...so I tried to build the street over the affected lots...that worked.  The streets were drawn in, and then when I tried to bulldoze, it worked and I rezoned the 6x2 area and it was restored such as you see it.  Notice I put a park in the general area of where the old Tennis Court was...however I do not think that had a bearing on anything. 
  The reason I'm posting this is:  I have had peculiar instances in other cities when using some lots, such as the Rural Tennis Court, in which the query in adjacent areas would always come up as the other lot, same as the first post of this little story.  So I'm wondering in the case of the real Prop-pox affected cities, are we using Custom Lots that are in someway interferring with the Draw system of nearby areas, and hence not allowing the full lot of that area to be drawn?
Bruce

[wouanagaine]

I think you may experiencing the growing empty lot & the immortal lot syndroms both a the same time

It may be a good reason for prop pox to appear anyway

[RippleJet]

Bruce, would you have a link to that rural Tennis Court?
I'd like to take a look at the modding of it.

[BruceAtkinson]

Hey, RJ....here it is: http://www.simtropolis.com/stex/index.cfm?id=2153
  It is a "Rural Minor League Stadium" Pack from simtropolis.  I've had it for quite a long time....
Bruce

[RippleJet]

Hey, RJ....here it is: http://www.simtropolis.com/stex/index.cfm?id=2153
  It is a "Rural Minor League Stadium" Pack from simtropolis.  I've had it for quite a long time....
Bruce

Thanks Bruce!

All eight stadiums included in that package by gshmails are modded the same way and are heavily "immortal".

The stadiums themselves are Maxis props, and the invisible building is centered 8.8 m from the left edge and 8.8 m the upper edge.
However, the width of the invisible building is set to 104 m and the depth to 110 m.
These should both have been 16 m, but have obviously been manually modded.

Thus, the building overhangs 60.8 m (2.7 tiles) on the left side and 63.8 m (2.9 tiles) on the upper side.
That means that any other lot within three tiles to the left and behind the stadium will get the same name and query as the stadium.
And you will have problems succesfully bulldozing the stadiums and affected neighbouring lots.

[BruceAtkinson]

Thank-you!, RJ....that explains alot from some other issues I had, using the stadiums....I thought maybe I was on to a small breakthrough with the dreaded Proppox, but alas...we're not there yet!
Bruce
By the way, since I have your attention....one of my cities, Pacifica will cause an immediate Crash to Desktop, and me thinks I have inadvertently corrupted the last save, is there any way that one can examine the file to see what has corrupted and possibly correct it?
  Bruce

[dragonshardz]

By the way, in reply to the "removing plugins and loading city w/o deleting instances of removed plugin" theory, I can begin to refute it. I removed a particular set of outdated lots, and loaded a city with the outdated lots in it after removing the files multiple times. There has been no case of "Prop Pox" yet!

[snorrelli]

By the way, in reply to the "removing plugins and loading city w/o deleting instances of removed plugin" theory, I can begin to refute it. I removed a particular set of outdated lots, and loaded a city with the outdated lots in it after removing the files multiple times. There has been no case of "Prop Pox" yet!

Yes - as I said above, many of us have done it, but only a few of us have developed the Pox. So, if it's related at all, it's not the only reason. For example:

- If rendering/save engine encounters an instance of a lot that is missing from plugins, and X, Y or Z...

[BarbyW]

I am now another victim of the prop pox Only with Maxis props though. I really only noticed today when I plopped the mayor's house and this is what I saw:



This is a small city of less than 2000 inhabitants and has only been started today. It is the Grand River Valley region for mrbisonm's Region Play at Simtrop. I went through other cities and the mayor's house, the Maxis churches, City Hall plus any custom lots that use a lot of Maxis props are affected. None of the city files are over 3MB and I haven't changed any settings. I do have one thing to try though. I shall report back.

[wouanagaine]

Could it be related to the patching we tried in another place ?

[BarbyW]

Well I suppose it could be. I'll try to undo that.

[snorrelli]

Ouch - I must admit other people have reported missing only Maxis props before and I've dismissed these cases as "not the Pox." Maybe it's a related ailment? A different strain of the same disease? Just to clarify, were the props missing from the moment you plopped or did it look fine initially and you discovered the props missing after a subsequent save-exit-reentry?

[BarbyW]

I can confirm it is not related to Wou's comment. It was and remains the same when plopped in this tile as I have demolished and replopped after waiting a while. The even odder thing is that some of the props and overlays missing are showing on other lots. I checked a number of tiles in this region and the mayor's house shows the same on all of them. I have no idea when it started as I often just plop and don't really look with the mayor's house etc. None of the tiles have a population of over 50k

[snorrelli]

Hmmm... Very odd - particularly since you've got the two lamp posts and the hedge fencing...

[Diggis]

did you check it in another region?

[dragonshardz]

considering the Prop Pox afects only single cities I don't think that would

Never mind. I have noticed, when scrolling in my largest city, that before the render "wave" goes across the screen, Peg's canals in particular look Poxed. Thankfully they haven't ever STAYED Poxed.

~~Dragonshardz~~