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Recent posts
#81
BSC Cleanitol / Re: BSC Cleanitol TM
Last post by mgb204 - April 13, 2023, 03:06:55 AMYeah this is a tricky one, because whilst I absolutely use the Install/Plugins folder myself, for regular users, it really isn't a good idea. I certainly don't put my main Plugins suite there, rather those fixes what are common to all my many Plugins suites I have (there are many).
Maxis never intended for entire Plugins suites to be located there, so neither did the creators of Cleanitol. Again, it's quite right to say absolute carnage could be caused with the wrong script ran in Program Files, the sort where you are formatting drives and starting your system over from scratch. Even in the less serious category, if you ran a script that clears out non-SC4 files in a place with all your photos/documents etc, in one foul swoop, you could loose a lot of data. Sure Cleanitol doesn't delete anything, it moves it and even offers a single script for restoring things to how they were. But there are scenarios where that may not prevent data loss.
So in essence, you CAN use the Install folder, but since this is an advanced/unintended method, you can expect little issues like this. Simple work-around, temporarily copy the contents to the UserDIR Plugins folder before running Cleanitol, then restore them afterwards.
Maxis never intended for entire Plugins suites to be located there, so neither did the creators of Cleanitol. Again, it's quite right to say absolute carnage could be caused with the wrong script ran in Program Files, the sort where you are formatting drives and starting your system over from scratch. Even in the less serious category, if you ran a script that clears out non-SC4 files in a place with all your photos/documents etc, in one foul swoop, you could loose a lot of data. Sure Cleanitol doesn't delete anything, it moves it and even offers a single script for restoring things to how they were. But there are scenarios where that may not prevent data loss.
So in essence, you CAN use the Install folder, but since this is an advanced/unintended method, you can expect little issues like this. Simple work-around, temporarily copy the contents to the UserDIR Plugins folder before running Cleanitol, then restore them afterwards.
#82
SimCity 4 General Discussion / Re: Using SC4Tool to identify ...
Last post by Tyberius06 - April 13, 2023, 03:03:33 AM@doug_wesson :
It is not even listing any versions of the BSC Mega Props SG vol01, not on the LEX download page and not on the STEX download page, and not in the readme. The proper dependency list was listed in the dependency tracker which is currently offline.
If you are refering to the given list based on the LD property ("Required Files (LTD Files)" - as it shows up in the SC4 Tool), you should generally be careful with that as that information can be fals. In this case it is not false and it seems that back in the time they failed to list the SG prop pack as dependency OR the older version of the BSC Essentials (released on STEX at that time) could have contained those props which later got into the SG Mega Props. For 16 years there was an outdated SG Mega Props version available on the STEX under the same name as the then-updated version of the same prop pack re-released on LEX. It was me last year who got rid of the older versions and on both sites now we have the latest v2 version.
With all the updates what I've been doing, they are backwards compatible. If an older upload is listing a certain prop pack, but you have a version with a higher version number, the newer version is also working fine with that upload. You should simply remove the one without the version number (or lower version number) and replace it with the newer or highest version number. The biggest change is, that now v2 (and yes, there will be even a v3 as well, which I'm already working on) contains mostly all the commonly used props from simgoober, which were originally dumpped into the BSC Mega Props MISC vol02. It might seem confusing, but the older contents with the newever prop pack versions are completley backwards compatible.
But for sure, the LTD-file list (or LD property if you check the file in ilieve Reader) is something which is generated by the Maxis Lot Editor and often contains fals information and for exemple with newer lot files or files created with SC4PIM-X and never touched by Maxis LE, you won't even have this list as PIM-X never generates this LD property. Sometimes it is useful with these older contents because it can lead to actual dependencies, but many/most of the times it has fals information.
@mgb204 : hm... most of the cleanitol files are only for removing stuffs and a very few is using the *.txt-s as collecting the dependency links.
I'm doing my best, but we are still talking about 1000+ uploads which needs to be checked and occasionally updated/fixed and since we temporary lost the dependency tracker I need to update the readme files for the proper dependency links too. That was NOT the plan, as the DT should have taken care of that...
Thanks for mentioning the cleanitol files, I'll take extra care to check what they are refering to, but so far if I recall correctly only the two real mf BSC Airport and BSC Seaport uploads are using the cleanitol to collect dependencies and not just removing obsolete files. And I put dependency links into the updated cleanitol of the BSC Mega Props MISC vol02 (as it has dependencies) and some of the CSX MEGA Props.
Now I'm going through one by one on most of the BSC items on LEX and check them against obvious issues etc... I've already found a handfull of stuffs which were inhereted from original releases back in 2004-2006 still on the STEX, but were failed to be updated and fixed later on when they were re-released on LEX. And I'm updating the readme files too to reference the latest versions.
I can tell, that many of the most popular dependency packs will be updated to a new version once again (v2-s to v3 and some of the v3-s to v4 and if everything goes well, then there will be a final version of the BSC Essentials as v202x it depends on which year I get there), when I finally finished with this whole project.
At the end, a database like Nos17's prop and texture catalogue after getting an update with the new and finalized prop packs, could list most of the props even those ones which are currently hiding in sc4lot files.
QuoteDeadwoods Ministry of Garbage and it identifies that
BSC MEGA PROPS - SG Vol01.dat is missing
It is not even listing any versions of the BSC Mega Props SG vol01, not on the LEX download page and not on the STEX download page, and not in the readme. The proper dependency list was listed in the dependency tracker which is currently offline.
If you are refering to the given list based on the LD property ("Required Files (LTD Files)" - as it shows up in the SC4 Tool), you should generally be careful with that as that information can be fals. In this case it is not false and it seems that back in the time they failed to list the SG prop pack as dependency OR the older version of the BSC Essentials (released on STEX at that time) could have contained those props which later got into the SG Mega Props. For 16 years there was an outdated SG Mega Props version available on the STEX under the same name as the then-updated version of the same prop pack re-released on LEX. It was me last year who got rid of the older versions and on both sites now we have the latest v2 version.
With all the updates what I've been doing, they are backwards compatible. If an older upload is listing a certain prop pack, but you have a version with a higher version number, the newer version is also working fine with that upload. You should simply remove the one without the version number (or lower version number) and replace it with the newer or highest version number. The biggest change is, that now v2 (and yes, there will be even a v3 as well, which I'm already working on) contains mostly all the commonly used props from simgoober, which were originally dumpped into the BSC Mega Props MISC vol02. It might seem confusing, but the older contents with the newever prop pack versions are completley backwards compatible.
But for sure, the LTD-file list (or LD property if you check the file in ilieve Reader) is something which is generated by the Maxis Lot Editor and often contains fals information and for exemple with newer lot files or files created with SC4PIM-X and never touched by Maxis LE, you won't even have this list as PIM-X never generates this LD property. Sometimes it is useful with these older contents because it can lead to actual dependencies, but many/most of the times it has fals information.
@mgb204 : hm... most of the cleanitol files are only for removing stuffs and a very few is using the *.txt-s as collecting the dependency links.
QuoteBecause once you do that, things like Cleanitol files and file listings like this, will no longer recognise them as the correct file.If you are refering to private listings or custom cleanitols made by the players for themselves, well, that's bad luck. IF they were able to work with those by themselves, then probably as unconfortable as it might be it's up to them to update it again for themselves.
I'm doing my best, but we are still talking about 1000+ uploads which needs to be checked and occasionally updated/fixed and since we temporary lost the dependency tracker I need to update the readme files for the proper dependency links too. That was NOT the plan, as the DT should have taken care of that...
Thanks for mentioning the cleanitol files, I'll take extra care to check what they are refering to, but so far if I recall correctly only the two real mf BSC Airport and BSC Seaport uploads are using the cleanitol to collect dependencies and not just removing obsolete files. And I put dependency links into the updated cleanitol of the BSC Mega Props MISC vol02 (as it has dependencies) and some of the CSX MEGA Props.
Now I'm going through one by one on most of the BSC items on LEX and check them against obvious issues etc... I've already found a handfull of stuffs which were inhereted from original releases back in 2004-2006 still on the STEX, but were failed to be updated and fixed later on when they were re-released on LEX. And I'm updating the readme files too to reference the latest versions.
I can tell, that many of the most popular dependency packs will be updated to a new version once again (v2-s to v3 and some of the v3-s to v4 and if everything goes well, then there will be a final version of the BSC Essentials as v202x it depends on which year I get there), when I finally finished with this whole project.
At the end, a database like Nos17's prop and texture catalogue after getting an update with the new and finalized prop packs, could list most of the props even those ones which are currently hiding in sc4lot files.
#83
SimCity 4 General Discussion / Re: Using SC4Tool to identify ...
Last post by mgb204 - April 13, 2023, 01:07:49 AMI have to say (sorry @Tyberius06, I know you are working very hard on this), but renaming dependency files like this, even if just to denote a version number, is really not ideal. Because once you do that, things like Cleanitol files and file listings like this, will no longer recognise them as the correct file. It sucks, but some things once they have existed, become necessary to keep that way or you run into all sorts of problems and confusions. When we're talking about some of the most commonly used files in the community, continuity is a must IMO. The problem of balancing user friendliness with retaining backwards compatibility is always a tricky line to walk though.
One the other side, by giving each file a clear version number, I can envisage a number of scenarios where that might be helpful. For example, in the event of a user having problems, anyone helping could ask you which version you have?, making it easy to see if you've the update or not. Also, having a distinct version number for the files, provides clarity to end users, should they find they have both files.
In an ideal world a user would rid themselves of any old versions when updating, so they never accidentally used it, the old one is after all obsolete. Likewise if troubleshooting, the first thing would be to tell the user to ensure they are using the newer version. This is quite simply established by the date in the file MetaData which Windows easily reveals. In the event of confusion, just advise to download the new one and use it instead to be 100% certain. The problem here is that users don't always want to handle things so rigidly, so as creators we are always asking ourselves, how can we avoid this or that problem.
Don't get me wrong, I know there is a need to differentiate one file from another, but in cases like this I think it would be better to do that with the download itself (.zip file), not the filename of its contents. If nothing else because the sheer amount of existing content that now fails to work due to changing it, given it's easy to mitigate against the potential problems.
One the other side, by giving each file a clear version number, I can envisage a number of scenarios where that might be helpful. For example, in the event of a user having problems, anyone helping could ask you which version you have?, making it easy to see if you've the update or not. Also, having a distinct version number for the files, provides clarity to end users, should they find they have both files.
In an ideal world a user would rid themselves of any old versions when updating, so they never accidentally used it, the old one is after all obsolete. Likewise if troubleshooting, the first thing would be to tell the user to ensure they are using the newer version. This is quite simply established by the date in the file MetaData which Windows easily reveals. In the event of confusion, just advise to download the new one and use it instead to be 100% certain. The problem here is that users don't always want to handle things so rigidly, so as creators we are always asking ourselves, how can we avoid this or that problem.
Don't get me wrong, I know there is a need to differentiate one file from another, but in cases like this I think it would be better to do that with the download itself (.zip file), not the filename of its contents. If nothing else because the sheer amount of existing content that now fails to work due to changing it, given it's easy to mitigate against the potential problems.
#84
SimCity 4 General Discussion / Using SC4Tool to identify prob...
Last post by doug_wesson - April 12, 2023, 08:48:25 PMOne of the first lots I was looking at was Deadwoods Ministry of Garbage and it identifies that
BSC MEGA PROPS - SG Vol01.dat is missing
That this has been replaced by
BSC MEGA PROPS - SG Vol01_v2.dat
How does this affect the use of this lot and is there a way of rectifying it so it recognizes the new dat file
Many thanks in advance
BSC MEGA PROPS - SG Vol01.dat is missing
That this has been replaced by
BSC MEGA PROPS - SG Vol01_v2.dat
How does this affect the use of this lot and is there a way of rectifying it so it recognizes the new dat file
Many thanks in advance
#85
BSC Cleanitol / Re: BSC Cleanitol TM
Last post by Tyberius06 - April 12, 2023, 05:19:20 PMQuotebecause I install all my mods in the game's plugin folder.
Well, that's an issue... You should NOT install the mods into the game's plugin folder, instead almost all of the mods should go into the documents/simcity4/Plugins folder (the only exceptions are the *.DLL mods, like the extra cheats and the sc4fix - the dll mods can go into the game's plugins folder). So you can start moving and installing them into the proper location and after that the cleanitol will work as it was intended.
EDIT:
It doesn't matter where you installed the cleanitol program itself - it should be installed by the way into the Program Files or Program Files (x86) as that is an application/program/tool, and it's not a plugin.
It does matter, however, where you installed the plugins. By default they should go into the Documents/Simcity4/Plugins. The cleanitol is designed to check the Documents/Simcity4/Plugins folder (where you should have installed almost all of your plugins) as many of the actual cleanitol text files, that are listing the to be removed files also listing *.jpg/*.png/*.exe etc... extensions which are useless for the game and sometimes come with the uploaded ZIP files. But if you run it elsewhere on your computer it can cause serious issues with other programs, so that's why it is limited to locate files in the default location...
The creators of the Cleanitol tool luckily did make it sure that less techy users would not make irreversible mistakes by deleting essentials system files or essential files from other programs...
#86
SC4 Tool / Re: Is the program source avai...
Last post by Ulisse Wolf - April 12, 2023, 02:17:23 PMQuote from: Andreas on April 12, 2023, 12:27:08 PMInteresting, where did you find that? Did simrolle upload the orgininal source code somewhere else back then?
I did reverse engineering to the program. C# makes it easy to get the source code.
We are doing this with all modding programs. In fact we have a page with all links to get the source code. The only program missing is PIM-X
https://community.simtropolis.com/forums/topic/762189-simcity-4-open-access-repository-of-modding-tools/
#87
SC4 Tool / Re: Is the program source avai...
Last post by Andreas - April 12, 2023, 12:27:08 PMInteresting, where did you find that? Did simrolle upload the orgininal source code somewhere else back then?
#88
BSC Cleanitol / Re: BSC Cleanitol TM
Last post by Sniffeh - April 12, 2023, 12:08:19 PMQuote from: wouanagaine on January 22, 2007, 02:20:56 AMI have upload the BSC Cleanitol TM tool to the LEX here
It ships with a basic cleanitol file that will move everything not needed by the game on a BSC_Cleanitol folder under your MyDoc\SimCity 4
Press the '...' button on top, and select cleanupList.txt,
Press 'locate' to find if you have unuseful files. It will also tell you if you have the building as props from maxis
Press 'Backup' to actually move the files
Everytime you press backup and if some files need to be moved they will be moved to a subfolder of MyDoc\SimCity 4\BSC_Cleanitol. the subfolder will be named by date/number of time you press on that date
It will also generate a report.html that you can read to see what have moved, and an undo.bat is also generated just in case you want old files to be moved again into your plugins
If you have downloaded latest SimGoober texture pack, you can use this tool with the shipped cleanitol file.
Why can't I choose the installation loacation? It won't find any duplicates in Progam Files or Documents because I install all my mods in the game's plugin folder.
#89
SC4 Tool / Re: Is the program source avai...
Last post by Ulisse Wolf - April 12, 2023, 11:28:21 AMQuote from: doug_wesson on April 11, 2023, 11:11:34 PMI would love to recompile to run under dotnet 4
We cannot guarantee that it is the real source code of SC4TOOL but it is a starting point. Consider that SC4TOOL there are bugs that cause the onset of the TE MAC Crash
https://github.com/h3ndofry/SC4Tool
#90
NAM Inactive threads / Re: Disable Maxis Steam Freigh...
Last post by mgb204 - April 12, 2023, 04:08:26 AMYou can remove Automata, it just requires a modified Exemplar, but that's simply one way to go. I'm honestly not sure if you can do this for just the Steam Engine, since the trucks/wagons would likely remain, only now without a train pulling them.
Rather than suppress all of this, I prefer to change the models to more modern engines. Until recently I was using SE (Steam Engine Replacements) from Vester, which include various US freight engines among his content.
A good way to replace the wagons is using this mod by Jim, it also includes the files to suppress the Maxis stuff, you could just use that if you wanted to. But it has excellent quality replacement wagons, a few mods do similar things with different models of course. Likewise for the Engines and all SC4 Automata, plenty of replacements exist for all sorts of time periods and places.
One useful thing, if you have the official Maxis DLC for the Air Force Base, you'll probably want this fix too, to make sure no Steam engines can appear.
As for the RRW Catenaries by Rivit, do note that it just provides the mechanism to place them on the RRW. You need to have this file installed which contains the actual models (catenaries) themselves. Rivit's mod is not 100% complete, but does cover all the base content and is probably the most complete such mod for RRW out there.
Rather than suppress all of this, I prefer to change the models to more modern engines. Until recently I was using SE (Steam Engine Replacements) from Vester, which include various US freight engines among his content.
A good way to replace the wagons is using this mod by Jim, it also includes the files to suppress the Maxis stuff, you could just use that if you wanted to. But it has excellent quality replacement wagons, a few mods do similar things with different models of course. Likewise for the Engines and all SC4 Automata, plenty of replacements exist for all sorts of time periods and places.
One useful thing, if you have the official Maxis DLC for the Air Force Base, you'll probably want this fix too, to make sure no Steam engines can appear.
As for the RRW Catenaries by Rivit, do note that it just provides the mechanism to place them on the RRW. You need to have this file installed which contains the actual models (catenaries) themselves. Rivit's mod is not 100% complete, but does cover all the base content and is probably the most complete such mod for RRW out there.