I'm at a loss - pls help

[coronadian]

Hello,

I'm completely new to this, but have been playing SC4 for ages. Anyways I've recently been looking into addons, and this cam thingy looks really interesting.

So I went ahead to install it...........but either I'm misunderstood something or this thing is insane.

I've install the basepack, all the dependencies, then the starter packs. Basically I tried to follow all the guides. So after about 100 exe installers that I have run, I thought I was finally set, but when I launched a test city I started getting boxes instead of buildings once cam buildings started to prop up.

For instance the ACME Pencil Factory, and the ACME Oil something factory, but also Residential buildings, like some Stage 4 Seaside Villa.

I looked again, and it appears the starter packs....which all have 7-10 exe in them allready, each and every one of those has an additional 5-10 dependencies on its own. For testers I have gone through one or two and indeed got some glass factory to show up.

But my question is, this can't be it right? It'll take me days upon days to go through all of these and install an additional 100 depencies. I already spent 4 hours clicking through exe wizards today. Is that really how its meant to be installed? Why can't there be an all in one download to get people going? Am I missing something?

Help a newbie out

[rooker1]

Unfortunately this is right.
You need to know that the CAM heas been out for some time now and that everything before CAM was modded correctly at the time, but not for CAM.  So when CAM was introduced it needed alot of remodding of many models for the CAM to work the way it is suppose to.  Than  over time many more new models were modded properly for the CAM.  So there are alot of work to do.
Sorry my friend.  If it makes you feel any better, I have gone through all this just recently.

Robin 

[WC_EEND]

I went trough all of that as well, however I only downloaded the needed dependancies when the brown boxes started showing. There is one alternative and that is donating for the LEX CD/DVD. That way, you have most (not all, but almost all) of the CAMelots packed onto one disk that is shipped with a (very nifty in my opinion) possibility to install everything on it. And you also get some very exclusive content that is not on the LEX.

[coronadian]

Puh....I was afraid of that.

I think I'll just remove it again, I fear I'm going insane otherwise. But how, there are no uninstallers that I can see from all these exes?

[Korot]

The dependencies from this thread [linkie] don't include the models for the actual buildings. Of the model files you need to download, you only need the .SC4Model file, all other files can be safely deleted. In fact, it is best if you delete them, to avoid the non-CAMpatible buildings also included in those model downloads to show up in game.

As to why the starter packs include 5 to 7 different .exe files: Only God knows, and it's best left to him...
I personally don't understand why they can't include just 1 .exe, in which you can select witch buildings to install, and then provide a link to the models, if you don't have them already.

As to why it isn't in one big download: The model files are copyrighted work, and thus can't be uploaded somewhere else, without the authors permission. Though you could of course ask those authors for permission, sadly, a lot of the authors are inactive, and thus can't be asked. Also, the file would simply be to big to download, think of somewhere around 0.5 GB, which would be 60 model files, or thereabout. The LEX simply can't pull that.
"So why aren't the starter packs themselves all included in one big download?" I hear you asking, well the reason is partly that the file would be quite big, though not as big as the model file, and that not everybody wants all starter packs.

Thus my suggestion for when CAM 2.0 finally comes out, which I hope would be sooner rather than later is to have only one .exe per starter pack, in which you can select which buildings you want, and it will provide you with a list of files you need for these buildings, including links for those that aren't in the plugin folder yet. And also, to toss out buildings that have been updated, to avoid people having the same file twice. And that would be about it.

Regards,
Korot

[coronadian]

But what model files exactly do I need? All of those listed in the "CAMeLots - Linking all available lots and bats" thread? Those are......thousands....?

And then, many of those seem to have texture dependencies....and props dependencies.

I don't care if I have all the models available, but now that I've installed the cam base package it would be nice if things would kinda work.

TBH I don't even know what a bat or lot is. Then there is a model and texture, which I sort of understand.

[Korot]

But what model files exactly do I need? All of those listed in the "CAMeLots - Linking all available lots and bats" thread? Those are......thousands....?

And then, many of those seem to have texture dependencies....and props dependencies.

I don't care if I have all the models available, but now that I've installed the cam base package it would be nice if things would kinda work.

TBH I don't even know what a bat or lot is. Then there is a model and texture, which I sort of understand.

BAT = model, or building
Lot: Plot of land where building, or model, is build on top of.
Texture: Used on Lot, to cover standard ground texture. Also includes foothpaths, and all that.

And no, you don't need all those files. And no, it aren't thousands, hundreds, maybe, but I think that's stretching it. For starters, the .exe's in the starter packs should have opened a read-me at the end. This read-me includes links to dependencies. The dependencies listed for those models are NOT needed, unless you want to keep the old files/buildigns, which I don't recommend, since they aren't CAMpatible, as rooker1 nicely described.

*Wonders if there exists some sort of tutorial explaining all things custom content related, including what BAT means, and model, texture, prop, lot, building, LE, PIM, PIMX, etc. And all in plain English, such that I could in theory just drag someone from the street, let him play SC4 for about an hour, and that he would then be able to read the guide, and could truthfully say: "I completely understand what it says, and could use it if needed." Such a thing would be great.

Regards,
Korot

[coronadian]

Interesting.....yes the starter pack exes opened up readmes. So I don't need need those dependencies listed there. I installed a few as I said and it helped get some buildings to show up.

For instance as I said, I have this ACME pencil factory showing up as an ugly box. At first I thought I was a box factory, lol :-)

Anyways, how do I figure out what model I need for this? I tried clicking on the boxes? link at the top of this forum....but there is no pencil factory in this list. Same for my Stage 8 Seaside Villa....

I 'think' there are already custom models that get display.....I can't say for sure but my test city looks kinda different from my other cities. So there seem to be some models included already? Why not disable all lots/bats whatever for which the model could not be included per copyright problem, and tell users for this they need to install this and this.

BTW, the 500 mb download is not really an argument anymore in this day and age, is it?

In any case, thnx for your patience with this "idiot newbie" :-)

[mightygoose]

the reason it is all split up into several per starter pack is to allow players to install the bits they want, people with rural environments want to install the CAM for a more realistic game but might not want to install any buildings above stage 6, this is entirely possible with a modular setup like this.

as for all the external dependencies, SC4 has one of the most diverse and active Custom Content communities out there, so these guys tried to make as much of that as possible "campatible" that is why the list is so long, but if you want to play with it, you have to commit to it.

i have spent 40 hours making one region to play on, i do it because i love the potential it gives me. it all depends on what your looking for from SC4.

Although probably not the most helpful post, it is definitely something you should think about.

[Korot]

So I don't need need those dependencies listed there.

You need the dependencies listed in those read-me files, but not the dependencies for those dependencies.

Why not disable all lots/bats whatever for which the model could not be included per copyright problem,

What do you mean with disabling them? If you mean not to include them, please remind yourself that these starterpacks were released around the same time CAM was, and there weren't many buildings available, I.E. CAMpatible, back then. This way, Ripplejet and the other CAM modders made sure that there were enough buildings available, even though it would be quite a hassle to download them all. If you mean: make sure they never show up in game, regardless of you having them installed or not: That would simply be impossible, for reasons far to complicated to explain here.

and tell users for this they need to install this and this.

You're talking about the tons of dependencies? Well, when you install CAM, you don't have to install the starterpacks, though it is advised to do so, just to add more variety in the game. Though perhaps adding all dependency link to the starterpack download page on the LEX would help a lot.

BTW, the 500 mb download is not really an argument anymore in this day and age, is it?

Not to have in your plugin folder no, but to download all at once, yes. The LEX download speed is 500KB/s max, thus it would take around 20 min to download the file, substantially longer than all other files currently released. It would be even worse if my memory is faulty and the max speed is 500Kb/s. I'm also not even sure if the LEX would allow such a large file.

Regards,
Korot

[ScottFTL]

You could always donate to SC4D and receive the LEX DVD.  It allow you to install tons of custom content with a few clicks.

[BarbyW]

Unfortunately there are many CAM models that are not on the DVD or CD. We could only include those for which we had permission and I am afraid there are a number who would not allow that.

[xxdita]

Everyone forgets the Cleanitols for Free thread. The link is in my signature.

In this thread, I've created Cleanitol files for each of the CAMelot starter packs, to help everyone gather up the necessary files as easily as possible.

We may not be able to put everything for CAM all on one DVD, but the Cleanitols for Free thread is the next best thing, making use of Wouangaine's Cleanitol program to search your Plugins, tell you exactly what you're missing, and exactly where you can find it.

[coronadian]

First, thank you all for your replies.

Unfortunatly Cleanitol doesn't even start for me:

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "BSC Cleanitol TM.py", line 2, in ?
  File "zipextimporter.pyo", line 82, in load_module
  File "wx\__init__.pyo", line 45, in ?
  File "zipextimporter.pyo", line 82, in load_module
  File "wx\_core.pyo", line 4, in ?
  File "zipextimporter.pyo", line 98, in load_module
ImportError: MemoryLoadLibrary failed loading wx\_core_.pyd

Even when I run it as admin :-(

Anyways, I seem to have hunted down those model which were in my testcity, but I'm sure there are many more missing and as the city grows I'll have to go on a hunt again.

[jmyers2043]

as the city grows I'll have to go on a hunt again.

That's how I approached it. I stop the game - query the brown box to see what it says because that gives me a clue as to what building I am looking for - save the game - exit. I'll either read the 'readme' to see what dependencies I am after or just go to the  'linking all lots' thread. Download the model and install - start the game again and presto! I'm good to go until the next box.

Some times I didn't like the building. So I'd destroy the building, make a note to myself on a pad of paper, and delete the lot and model later at a convenient time.

[xxdita]

First, thank you all for your replies.

Unfortunatly Cleanitol doesn't even start for me:

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "BSC Cleanitol TM.py", line 2, in ?
  File "zipextimporter.pyo", line 82, in load_module
  File "wx\__init__.pyo", line 45, in ?
  File "zipextimporter.pyo", line 82, in load_module
  File "wx\_core.pyo", line 4, in ?
  File "zipextimporter.pyo", line 98, in load_module
ImportError: MemoryLoadLibrary failed loading wx\_core_.pyd

Even when I run it as admin :-(

Anyways, I seem to have hunted down those model which were in my testcity, but I'm sure there are many more missing and as the city grows I'll have to go on a hunt again.

You're missing the 2 required dll files for Cleanitol. Make sure you read the User's Guide, also conveniently written by me. 

[coronadian]

I see....its funny how everything in SC4 land seems to have dependencies :-)

Anyways, I'm kinda reluctant to install dlls into my windows install directory, especially if they are not linked to an uninstaller. 100% sure I'll forget to remove them when/if I delete the cleanitol some months down the road.

Anyways, this thread can be put to rest as far as I am concerned.

[Korot]

Those .dlls probably aren't used only by Cleanitol, otherwise, they would probably be included in the download. Also, I doubt you will one day stop downloading, and most (LEX) downloads come with a Cleanitol file to search for dependencies, so I suggest you'll keep Cleanitol installed.

Regards,
Korot

[ScottFTL]

Anyways, I'm kinda reluctant to install dlls into my windows install directory, especially if they are not linked to an uninstaller. 100% sure I'll forget to remove them when/if I delete the cleanitol some months down the road.

You don't have to install the DLLs to the Windows directory.  You can put them into the same directory where Cleanitol is installed.  It works fine this way.

[xxdita]

And considering the number of downloads for all of Wouanagaine's tools. there has not been one error or computer problem reported due to having the dll's in any folder. If you plan to use other tools from Wouanagaine, such as DatPacker, SC4Terraformer, or PIMX, then you'll want the dll's installed in your Windows folder, otherwise you'll need to have a seperate copy of both installed into each program folder.