MGB's Mods and other stuff

[matias93]

Great progress.

Robin forgive my ignorance on this matter but is the water texture baked in those pieces?
If not then, in time, I will redo the water texture into a more realistic fashion.

Nick

By the way, since using CAL-SG canals along the original SG's ones, I've taken them last as industrial ones, with more opaque water, as it were contaminated with chemical sands on suspension (the colour sugests copper salts). If you redone them, it would be interesting to keep the water opacity, so to keep that useful difference.

[mgb204]

In both cases (CAL's and SG's) the water used will be a match for the original sets. Anything else would stand out, which is something I'm looking to avoid.

[mgb204]

So just for fun, I thought I might call these the "CAL SG MB MGB Diagonal Canal Pieces". But who cares about names, what we have is 8 new pieces that expand CALs canals into the diagonal realm:



I just need to handle the lotting/modding parts now, then I'll get these out as soon as I can. There are some small visual imperfections. But when things line up in one rotation, but not others, what exactly can you do about it? Overall though, the issues are very minor compared to the new functionality on offer. I could spend countless hours trying to resolve them, but I think these are much better released as-is.

[Tyberius06]

 

Oh dear!!! Many-many thanks for this....

I don't want to be greedy, just curiosity: how about CAL's other type of canals the brick one I think? I can't recall if there has been spoken about that already. Or what was the problem with that...

But,

Huge thanks for this work!!!

[vortext]

Sweet! 

And yeah I noticed in my BAT endeavors it's quite finicky to get canals, or any type of (sea) wall for that matter, to line up properly ingame. Doesn't really matter though since for pixel perfect result of pics some post-processing is necessary anyway.

On that note, i.e. me tinkering with seawalls, I was wondering if the 1x1 water tile you mentioned could be used to create other canal types with the same water? Or perhaps even make a transition to ingame water by some kind of gradient blend? 

[mgb204]

Sorry Eric, could you clarify... Do you want to make canals using the existing setup, but with a new type of water surface/colour? Or were you looking for the opposite, i.e. keeping the water the same (to match CALs), but changing the rest?

Either is theoretically possible. But you would have to re-make a lot of pieces in either case. I'm sure MattB325 wouldn't have an issue with me distributing these files for example. And a 1x1 Straight is already on the LEX. But the curves and bridge pieces are probably some of the hardest to make, which I don't think are available anywhere.

As for transitioning into game water, it should be possible. MAS71 made a preview with a few pieces that transition from his JRP water in this way. It's in a file "JRP_Transparent Water Beta.dat", I can't say from which of the JRP packs it comes from though, since they are all installers, but it's one of them. It's not really a seamless solution though. You're probably better off having some sort of culvert/dam/lock really, rather than make the water try and blend seamlessly.

As for your seawalls, prepare for some fun with the LODs  .

[matias93]

What I would add (but don't know how to do) is a 3 tile wide coast-overhanging canal lock lotted as a bus stop (for canal passenger barges) and ferry port, which could resolve easily the issue of transfering passengers from the two different water-based networks.


Of course that a seamless pass from canals to ingame water would look better on certain circumstances, but is harder to make and apply, and is less height-flexible, demanding sea-level terrain when a lock could adapt itself to different cliffs.


EDIT: I was forgetting this; will you keep the flowers aside the diagonal walls of the canals? Maybe a more wealth-neutral prop would do better...

[Girafe]

Just passing by, excellent job 

[mgb204]

What I would add (but don't know how to do) is a 3 tile wide coast-overhanging canal lock lotted as a bus stop (for canal passenger barges) and ferry port, which could resolve easily the issue of transfering passengers from the two different water-based networks.

Are you talking about a TE lot to transfer from CAN-AM to Ferries? That's a good idea, I may look into it.

Of course that a seamless pass from canals to ingame water would look better on certain circumstances.

I could probably re-use an existing piece somehow for this, since locks do exist. But transitioning to game water is no easy feat. Not to mention getting it to work with various water mods.

will you keep the flowers aside the diagonal walls of the canals?

These were copied over from the SG / MattB diagonal lots, I will look to use props that match the rest of CALs sets, so they are not necessarily going to stay.

[vortext]

Do you want to make canals using the existing setup, but with a new type of water surface/colour? Or were you looking for the opposite, i.e. keeping the water the same (to match CALs), but changing the rest?Either is theoretically possible. But you would have to re-make a lot of pieces in either case. I'm sure MattB325 wouldn't have an issue with me distributing these files for example. And a 1x1 Straight is already on the LEX. But the curves and bridge pieces are probably some of the hardest to make, which I don't think are available anywhere.

yes, the latter option. New canal type with CAL's water as I really like it - and failed to come up with any decent water of my own thus far. I wasn't aware the 1x1 tile was already on the LEX, will have to check that out. Also will have a look at JRP water. Thanks! 

As for your seawalls, prepare for some fun with the LODs  .

He, that's the least of my worries right now. It started as an exercise in spline modelling and sorta accidentally turned into a rather decent wall. However, atm it's one giant and quite messy poly because of all the bends, so I'd have to break it into 1x1 chunks and tidy them all up first of all. 

[noahclem]

Awesome work on these canals    I was really bummed during the original development when cal said he wouldn't be doing diagonals.

[mgb204]

yes, the latter option. New canal type with CAL's water as I really like it - and failed to come up with any decent water of my own thus far. I wasn't aware the 1x1 tile was already on the LEX, will have to check that out. Also will have a look at JRP water. Thanks! 

Absolutely, the only issue you'll find is that you won't be able to match it using a newer version of 3DS max. Actually, perhaps with your superior texturing skills, maybe you could work out the offsets and make it work, but I couldn't. Even with the exact same settings, the colour with 3DS Max 2011 is always off. I could help you out here, since I have a machine ready to handle the renders for you. But bear in mind, the colour differences would also affect the other parts of the model. If you could somehow just add the original canal water as a prop to models sans water, you'd probably have an easier time of things. But in that scenario, you'd loose the reflections. In many ways, the JRP water is even better IMO than CALs. It's not hard to see why when you see how it's put together. MAS71 blended two colours (textures) together with a number of other bump maps and settings to give a really rich detailed water that's somewhat translucent. That said, my attempts thus far to match that haven't yielded good results . But again, 3DS models for JRP are available with all the textures.

He, that's the least of my worries right now. It started as an exercise in spline modelling and sorta accidentally turned into a rather decent wall. However, atm it's one giant and quite messy poly because of all the bends, so I'd have to break it into 1x1 chunks and tidy them all up first of all. 

As for breaking it into chucks, perhaps check out the puzzle piece tutorial by Mandelsoft. Since I'd imagine the process for Transit models would work there too. Also, another reason to check out MAS71's work on the JRP models. He used meshes to make the embankments, which I think would be more ideal than polys.

[mgb204]

Ever since stumbling upon a cache of Elevated Rail Stations created by DocRorlach, I've thought about trying to finish them off. Having resolved some memory-related issues when opening these models, I've made some progress today. In total there are 7 stations, to my knowledge, sadly none of these have ever been released.



Here is the basic 6x1 Elevated Station. It's modelled really well. So it's a snap to create variants for Elevated Rail, Monorail, HSR and Viaduct Rail.



The original models are in gMax (SC4BAT), but I've already switched this model into 3DS Max, the render quality seems to be greatly improved. Note a few issues remain to iron out here.



The most exciting model is probably this Y-Station. Likely it will be the most work to mod.

Anyhow, I've barely started, but I would love to get these models into the hands of players eventually.

[mrbisonm]

I love DocRorlach's stuff. Great you decided to continue these stations. Love your stuff too.

Fred

[vortext]

Another exciting and promising project Robin! 

Thanks for the info on walls & water, currently not much time to look into it any further but useful to keep in mind when I do. 

[Simmer2]

Thanks for taking this project off my to do list 
I actually started to dabble with them 2 months ago but left them in the Iwillfinishthemeventually bin 

Nick

[bombardiere]

Looking great. It is always good to have more elevated stations.  Are there any historical stations?

[ramrec]

Great job what you are doing. I'm really impressed.

If you are thinking of working with DocRorlach's stations, maybe I could bring your attention to this beautiful piece I felt in love with the first time I saw it.

http://community.simtropolis.com/files/file/26965-wmp-art-deco-station/

Please keep going, it´s always fascinating to see such a kind of outcome.

[mgb204]

I don't want to be greedy, just curiosity: how about CAL's other type of canals the brick one I think? I can't recall if there has been spoken about that already. Or what was the problem with that...

Sorry to respond so late, I kind of missed this one.

I only have the model files and textures for the original pieces by SG and the CAL remakes. This doesn't include CAL's own brick canals, so the short answer is no. I really want to focus any work on CALs re-mastered SG canals. With time I think may create more useful things using them, I'm certainly missing the old water treatment facility (hint) from SGs set. I personally think Moonlight made some of the best canals, but since that can't be expanded, I've decided to make CAL's set my default canal setup from here on out.

I actually started to dabble with them 2 months ago...

Great minds think alike  - Did you manage to open them in SC4 BAT? I need to manually assign more memory to the scripting function to avoid CTDs when opening them.

Are there any historical stations?

I can give you a 15th Centaury medieval Elevated Rail station. It's invisible because trains haven't been invented yet  . More seriously, That's an interesting idea, but I'm not sure if textures alone would pull that off. One benefit of using someone else's models, I don't have to model it. But a drawback is that sometimes you're better off rebuilding it than trying to change it too much. However, if you could point me to some examples, I may consider it. An older station on the network is something that should work nicely for old and new. Plus I'm always for getting the most out of something.

If you are thinking of working with DocRorlach's stations, maybe I could bring your attention to this beautiful piece I felt in love with the first time I saw it.

The models shown here were unfinished. The files required to open them in SC4BAT along with the resources (textures) were made available for others to use. It's not possible to take an ordinary SC4 Model file and use that to edit it in any way. So unless the files used to create it were distributed, that means making a new one from scratch.

[bombardiere]

I can give you a 15th Centaury medieval Elevated Rail station. It's invisible because trains haven't been invented yet  . More seriously, That's an interesting idea, but I'm not sure if textures alone would pull that off. One benefit of using someone else's models, I don't have to model it. But a drawback is that sometimes you're better off rebuilding it than trying to change it too much. However, if you could point me to some examples, I may consider it. An older station on the network is something that should work nicely for old and new. Plus I'm always for getting the most out of something.

Well, I was thinking in line of something that could complement Morifari's Victorian elevated rail station. It is absolute favourite of mine, (hardly surprising ) but I could use variation. LOndo embankment type stations are what is in my mind, but I haven't pick any particular one. May be Brixton or something from that line. And Elephant & Castle is so ugly and brutalist that it must be done in SC4 some day.

I have actually planned to do a elevated rail terminus station in Cannon Streetish style. Not the modern one, but as it was around 1900 and smaller. three double lines and lot width of 5. The station hotel would in the lot and the platforms would be an overhanging prop. This would require a flat surface, but I am thinking that in this way special TE paths will not be needed and one station could serve El Rail, Elevated Heavy Rail, monorail and HSR.

I have downloaded some models from 3d Warehouse and converted those to 3DS MAX, but I think that most of times, it is actually easier to make own models. Because in this way, I can plan it ahead and other people's models may require a lot of re-modelling to make those work in SC4 environment. At least almost always the textures needs to be replaced and I feel that it is not a worth of the time. Of course, if the models are made the SC4 in mind, the re-work is easier.

And yes, an old building is often flexible as it can function in many periods. A lot of Georgian is torn down from London for example, but what is left is basically the same than 200 years ago.  The shop windows have change the most, but even if I am doing historic style windows, I can claim that it is an restoration project and include it in a modern city.