JBSimio Inc.

[Jmouse]

The apartments look great to me, JB. As for the parking lots, I'd rather have the slope-friendly buildings than flat parking lots. And you're going to have to show me the problem with the porch - I don't see it!

Absolutely terrific work - gotta' love it...
Joan

[WillG_75]

I REALLY hope you release those apartments, something that's long been missing from SC4.

[threestooges]

Always something new to see, and always something to learn (yes, I said learn). Still a bit confused about what all went on with the tower whose name eludes me, but perhaps looking at it in the morning might help. I would be interested if you could point me to the sources you used for your slope designs. That is a technique that would be useful to know. Hope all is well with work and family, and I'll keep an eye out for further stuff.
-Matt

[JBSimio]

SimNation:  Thanks!  They're honestly much more forgiving than I expected.

Andreas:  Thank you!  I've seen some of those parking lots too, although the spots that really scare me are where people are parked on the street facing downhill!  (There are big reminders everywhere around here to turn your wheels into the curb )

Kant:  Thanks!  The slope friendly part is what has been holding these back for so long... it's nice to finally be getting somewhere with them.

Joan:  Thank you!  The most obvious porch glitches are along the sidewalk running up the middle of the lot in the third picture.  (But it's also fixed now, so you won't see it again anyway )

WillG:  Thanks!  I REALLY plan to release them starting very soon. 

Matt:  Thank you!  Looking back over that post, I really didn't do a very good job of explaining the penthouse issues on the Hunter-Dulin Building.  The majority of my help on the slope designs came from Cycledogg and Jmyers on the BSC board.  I'm still not comfortable enough with it to make my own foundations... and I honestly only have the most basic knowledge of how the different slop properties impact what a lot can and can't do.  I'll always try to be of help, but I don't know how much good that will really be in this case! 

I've packaged up the Camalot Apartments and sent them off to yet another of those top secret testing facilities.  In the meantime, I got a start on Arbor Woods this afternoon.  These are the 3x2 medium wealth (which is the only wealth level this time) version.  I'm going to try to get a good start on some mega lot complexes still tonight...







As you can see, I'm still testing these on the most ridiculous slopes I can find.  I figure that if they work here, they should be no problem for the people who actually plan ahead for them.  I was pleasantly surprised to find that the front steps are even allowed to overhang the lot into the sidewalk a little bit.

More to come later,
JB

*EDIT... it's later!   

Just a little test of concept:







You're actually looking at 5 different lots here.  I thought it would be interesting to see what would happen if I tried to make a large apartment complex in pieces.  In theory, they could each grow separately, or be grouped together in the hopes that they would grow properly.  In reality, it would probably require tons of patience (and bulldozing) to get this result... and the individual pieces have the potential to look pretty dumb all by themselves.  So... I don't know if I'm really going to continue with this idea or not.  But I thought it looked cool, so I posted some pictures.     I may tinker with this some more... I don't know...

JB

[Rayden]

I disagree with you, they look super cool and you should keep the project and perhaps do some more of the sme kind. They look very suitable for mountain villages with steep slopes, where most of the other lots look weird.

[Andreas]

Andreas:  Thank you!  I've seen some of those parking lots too, although the spots that really scare me are where people are parked on the street facing downhill!  (There are big reminders everywhere around here to turn your wheels into the curb )

Ah, you mean those:



I don't want to be the delivery guy - there must be a mess inside that van, with everything piled up at the front wall of the box. 

Those new lots look excellent as well - and I also like the large ones. It would surprise me if they'd grow that way on their own indeed, but what about making a 12x12 mega lot instead? The only real limit is the number of props and textures that can be added, but I don't think you'll hit that limit soon with your setup.

[rushman5]

Yes, these lots would be great if they were abnormal, unused spaces, such as 4x12 or 7x13.  That way we can get rowhouses to grow where we want and these amazing apartments where we want them, specifically.  Excellent work on slope-friendly, I am very impressed.

[Jmouse]

The details you've included on the BATs is superb. Clever way you did the stair areas with the lattice behind, too. The buildings do need to grow in groups and the methodology for that is beyond me, but it looks like you're getting some good suggestions.

Later...
Joan

[JBSimio]

Rayden:  Thanks!  Don't worry... I won't be abandoning the whole project by any means.  Probably just the "complex in pieces" idea will get tossed out.  There are five different apartment buildings (actually six if you count the two styles for Stratton Apartments), most with different color combinations... so there are plenty more on the way.  Stratton Apartments and Camalot Apartments are both in testing now... Arbor Woods is the current one... Pheasant Run and Evergreen Hills are still coming. 

Andreas:  Thank you!  The scary thing is that it looks like that truck is full of seafood!  Very messy, indeed...   I initially avoided a 12x12 lot just because of the crime bug.  I know Ripplejet found and advertised a solution to that a while ago... but I still wonder if there are enough proper police stations out there to call it a "fixed problem" for most people.  But... then I decided that I'll just make the 12x12 lots anyway. 

Rushman:  Thanks!  I'll have to tinker with some of the more uncommon lot sizes that you mentioned.  It's really all a matter of making them fit and still looking alright.  We'll see what happens though.

Joan:  Thank you!  The lattice work, and everything else to do with the foundations (which in this case is the cream colored parts below the porches) is all thanks to Cycledogg.  He made the foundations for all of these and I can take no credit for how good they look.  All I can do is be happy he did such a great job on them!  Growing a bunch of the single building lots is not easy to do... especially because they are such common sizes with plenty of competition.  (I found this out in Covington real quick... I don't know how many of SimGoober's rowhomes I bulldozed waiting for that last "right" apartment to grow!)  Growing a mega lot is the easiest way to go... provided you zone for it and have the demand.  That's where this next idea comes in...

Speaking of SimGoober... I had what I thought was a fairly cool brain storm at work today.  Then I came home, looked at the BSC board and found a comment from him in which he suggested exactly what I had been thinking about.  Instead of just one lot with a bunch of buildings on it, how about making a "series" of mega lots that will upgrade through different growth stages?  That way, you can zone them early and still have something grow there even if the demand isn't that high yet.  A lot this large, you'd either have to let it sit blank for a while, or the game would just break it apart into smaller lots anyway... but if the lot is mostly empty, it has a lower stage, and therefore it can grow earlier... and then upgrade with your demand.  (At least I think that's how it works!  )  So here's a little teaser with that in mind...


Arbor Woods - Phase I:  12x12 Stage 1 lot, three buildings, R$$ - 418


Arbor Woods - Phase II:  12x12 Stage 3 lot, six buildings, R$$ - 834


Arbor Woods - Phase III:  12x12 Stage 5 lot, ten buildings, R$$ - 1387


Arbor Woods - Phase IV:  12x12 Stage 6 lot, sixteen buildings, R$$ - 2218

Obviously, these are completely undressed (cover the kid's eyes!) test lots at this point.  Truth be told, they're plopped... but the values listed are pretty accurate for what the growable versions would be.  Ultimately, the bare undeveloped parts in the earlier phases will be wooded or something to mimic a complex started on the edge of town.  As they upgrade, the woods get cleared and more buildings are added.  That's the plan anyway.  Because this could easily become a long process... I'll probably start releasing the single building lots first and making the mega lots into a later release.  But in the meantime... I'll keep tinkering with this idea.

JB

[projectadam]

JB,

You sir are a bright, shining star. These would be awesome lots if you can pull it off. Backtracking a little bit with the uneven terrain, I am just waiting to see the next picture where the earth has opened up and swallowed all signs of civilization

[XiahouDun]

Looks very good I've been thinking lately that SC4 needs some appartment complexes. One thought; if it were possible, would you be for Transit Enabling? Oh, and should have a building somewhere near the middle that is the apartment office too, just to add some realism.

Now that I see this, makes me want to model some of the apartments around me and throw them in the game the same way

[Swamper77]

These will not be transit-enabled because if they were, they would not upgrade at all. Transit-enabling prevents lots from upgrading like normal RCI lots.

-Swamper

[Pat]

Jon OMG WOW!!! fracking amazing sir!!!! WOW!!! I honestly have no words to truly express what I am thinking here at all... I do have one suggestion though when you do the first stage with a few buildings on it when lotting would it be possible to have a field look to it? I mean like you know the farmers look where there is still some corn growing and some muddy look to it...

That is just a thought I had for the Stage 1 and for the stage 2 - 3 maybe throw in a construction sites or building foundations? The final stage I think the middle would look great with a pool and patio area sorta like what you showed on 20th @ 10:15 PM cst...

OK so I found my train of thoughts of what to say lol... I hope I didnt sound like I was rambling to much but dang I love the idea of upgrading Arbor Woods Residental!!!!  I cant wait to see more!!!

Patrick

[XiahouDun]

I had a feeling that was the case Swamper, just wanted to check and make sure.

[rushman5]

Those upgradable lots.....freakin genius.  Simgoober is a think-tank in his own right.  Excellent concept and beautiful (so far) execution.

[Jmouse]

What a wonderful idea, JB - beautiful slope-friendly apartments that grow in response to R$, $$ and $$$ demands. As somebody once said, "What will they think of next!"

I've seen many apartment complexes in RL that develop in just the way you described. You've already thought of the pool/patio and dumpster lots, and I'm sure you'll get many more good ideas. I've no idea how props fit into an overall in-game process like this. Since they don't grow - at least none of mine ever did - I wonder about adding things over time or allowing room for them. For example, a fence and fancy stone signs at the entrance might look good in the $$ stages. And in the $ stage, I'd plant some weeds and wildflowers on the undeveloped lots if I could.

I really like all the apartments you've made, and this particular project is especially exciting.

Joan

[JBSimio]

Projectadam:  Awww shucks... thanks!  I'm fairly confident that it can be pulled off in some form... but there are a couple details I need to learn before I can say what that final form might be.  That uneven terrain is actually the "Big City Tutorial" from the Timbuktu region that shipped with Rush Hour.  I use it a lot for testing residential lots just because it's one of the few larger cities with lots of demand that I don't have any custom content in (I never save it when I'm done checking things).  It really is quite an eye opener to see how far we've come with slope mods, isn't it? 

XiahouDun:  Thanks!  I'm still considering a leasing office building or something along those lines... it really boils down to if I want to make 5 of them or try to come up with something generic enough that it would fit any of the complexes.   

Swamper:  Thanks for adding that.  I rarely remember to TE the things that I really could (some school driveways would have been a good idea!) anyway... 

Pat:  Holy buckets!  I'm really glad you like the idea so much!  And thank you for all the extra ideas.  Some of them were already in my head... like the pool/patio area... but there are a couple others that I hadn't thought of which I really like.  The farm fields are a great idea which I am completely planning to use now.  Some construction underway also sounds good depending on how things shape up.  Maybe on of the complexes could switch color schemes half way through as if they just got a new paint job?  Who knows... so many possibilities! 

Rushman:  Thanks!  It's kind of scary to think that I was having the same ideas as one of the masters like SimGoober!  (I suppose that could be taken a few different ways... but we'll just leave that alone and assume it was the humble compliment to him that it was meant to be) 

Joan:  Thank you!  You're right in that props don't grow... there is some relation to the wealth level of the lot which helps to determine if a certain prop will show up though.  This process is actually a little simpler than that.  Basically, all I'm trying to do is use the game's growth stages to my advantage.  The "upgrading" here is nothing like the upgradable seaports... instead each phase is an entirely new lot set to a higher growth stage.  It can still be completely random though.  It's exactly like when the Maxis "small cottages" lot grows into the Maxis "two story house"... the difference here is that the next lot in the sequence isn't something entirely new.  Instead it's an extension of the previous stage.  My hope is that making these lots in sizes that few (if any) other people have used will make it more likely that my sequence is the only option for that lot.  (In reality, the whole lot will still go to that blank construction phase in between each upgrade)  Going back to the props... this means that I can leave things off the early stage lots and add them to the first lot that seems appropriate.

There are still a few things to be answered before I'll know for sure how well this may or may not work.  I'd like to make different wealth levels a part of this as well... but that may complicate things a bit more.  The biggest thing I want to avoid is any possibility that the lot could go "backwards."  It would be nice to have low, medium, and high wealth versions of these... but I'm not exactly sure how the growth stages are impacted when a lot goes from R$ to R$$.  I'd hate to see a low wealth Phase III "upgrade" to a medium wealth Phase II!  That just seems kind of silly... but I'm not sure about that yet.  Worst case is that there would be a complete series that begins as low wealth and passes through medium wealth on its way to high wealth.  The only drawback to this would be that you could never have a "finished" complex in low wealth.  It's either that or each series is one wealth level only.  So... we'll see.

No real new progress tonight.  I played with some ideas and changed to a six stage series... but I don't really want to start a bunch of lotting until the issue above is sorted out.  I just wanted to stop in and give a little update anyway. 

JB

[Swamper77]

Swamper:  Thanks for adding that.  I rarely remember to TE the things that I really could (some school driveways would have been a good idea!) anyway... 

Jon,

You can transit-enable plops without any issue, other than they may change the slopes of the nearby roads when they connect to them and cars will be stopping at the new intersections. There have been various arguments over transit-enabling lots. Some want the TE'ing done so the lot's driveways will connect to the roadways. Others will say that the extra intersections will slow down traffic and affect the Sims' commutes. Personally, I rather not have lots TE'd so I can place them where I want to and not affect the slopes of the nearby roadways.

-Swamper

[XiahouDun]

Normally I'm against them too, but a lot that size with the drives just kinda begs for it

[Swamper77]

Xaihou Dun,

I hear you, but it would prevent his project from upgrading through the various phases if he did that. It would be stuck at whichever phase developed for eternity. Best not to for this project

-Swamper