Three Rivers Region

[joelyboy911]

The street to road now looks a bit on the abrupt side for me, personally. This MD (If it can still be called that) is really great. After entering the SC4 modding community near the beginning of the year (ths year) (after playing vanilla on and off for a few years), I looked in here occasionally. Now I can't stop. 

I was also wondering how the RealRoads are planned to be implemented? Will they be SAM style overrides? replacements, wealth based? (Sorry if you mentioned this earlier).

Yes, colonoscopies are horrible, my father had to have a series of them before being diagnosed with coeliacs disease (gluten intolerance). Apparently it might be hereditary - hopefully I don't get it. 

EDIT:  A good time to post, my friend!  Welcome to the Double-0 Club. -DE

[threestooges]

That looks a lot more like what I can recall seeing (still no picture, sorry...) though it would almost seem like it would bleed more where the cars' tires would drag the darker asphalt onto the lighter.

That prompts another question though... is the lighter stuff conrete or just a lighter asphalt?

Glad to hear you're clear for a year on the colonoscopy thing my friend.
-Matt

[sithlrd98]

I am wondering...do the streets have to be the color they are? I actually don't recall ever seeing that light of a street , most of the time they look like roads without the same markings.Which is another reason I vote to keep the asphalt streets texture for the SAM Most of the time I also don't see any crosswalks , but do see a "stop" or "slow" marking on them. Of course , if we are talking about realistic looking streets/roads...I have never seen such clean roads/streets consistently throughout a city anywhere , most have cracks/patches. Whatever the route, these "proof of pics" are still a FAR cry from what Maxis did!

Jayson

[Battlecat]

I tend to agree with sithlrd98's assessment there.  The traditional street texture is far lighter than what I've seen in most place.  In reality, streets are made using the exact same surface materials as major roads, only the width, capacity and line work is really different.  But perhaps a color that splits the difference between the darkest black and that really light grey would look good, we might not want the streets to be identical to the roads in color.

[WC_EEND]

On an end note, no more colonoscopies for a year- what a relief!

what are those? (because I've never heard of something like that before)

EDIT: already explained

Back ontopic, I think you are doing a truly wonderful job here, really pushing the game limits and then moving them by about a mile (as a figure of speech)

PS: I agree with Jayson about the streets

[Ryan B.]

what are those? (because I've never heard of something like that before)

Here you go.[linkie]

EDIT:  Read at your own risk!  Sorry, folks.

[mayorfabz]

 Uh-oh. Too much information

[ecoba]

Not To Ruin Your Fun, David...

But Heblem has already made some street-road transitions..

Ethan

[joelyboy911]

Hmmm... IMO, you could get rid of asphalt SAM, If instead those textures are made into a replacement mod. Some pieces from it are missing though, and it reverts to concrete. I know, because I use it for nearly all my streets. If it could be a texture replacement instead I would not be concerned about it being omitted from the SAM, even at the expense of the MAXIS streets (In fact I would be pleased about it).

[sithlrd98]

Yeah, I've thought about that myself. That would also free up a SAM spot! Of course, I'm not completely sure if any permission from Hab/Heb would be needed to use his as a "base" to get the transitions etc. completed. Of course , one could just take the Maxis streets and give them a little darker coloring and Bam...whole new set!Of course I'm sure Dr. Dedgren the texture master is probably FAR ahead of us on this  !

Jayson

[joelyboy911]

Well, I've never visted the USA outside of Los Angeles, San Francisco and the towns inbetween on the Pacific Coast Highway, but I don't recall too many concrete streets: I know that concrete is used on some Interstates in especially hot regions where the asphalt would melt, but aside from this I don't know of any concrete roadways anywhere else, certainly not in New Zealand. However, as discussed by Lora (ldvger) in her new San Francisco MD, many of the things in game are based on the Bay Area, where maxis operate(d). Perhaps there are concrete streets in suburban areas there (I don't recall - there may well have been). I don't know how active Heblem is these days, certainly he is not on this site. You are right in saying that darkening the maxis ones could be a viable option.

[metarvo]

I use the Maxis streets in older, medium-wealth urban areas, but I admit that I do so mainly to use the streetside mods and T21s that are available only on the Maxis streets and not on SAM streets.  I tend to use the SAM-4 gravel streets for low-wealth neighborhoods and the SAM-7 asphalt streets for new subdivisions.  As another option, what if the Maxis street was replaced with a narrow RealRoad with no center stripe?  This way, we would have a darker street as the default.

[sithlrd98]

The only places that I usually see a concrete type solution is on bridges and occasionally highways. So as food for thought, if the Maxis street dimensions are acceptable,then I think giving them a slight layer of asphalt would work well instead of adopting the asphalt street textures as I am sure that there are pieces left out. Of course this would also require a re-texture of hundreds of odds and ends! I am not volunteering , but with a consensus of color etc, maybe breaking them up into small groups, and assign certain IIDs , they could be done as smaller project? Just a thought I get one every once and again...of course they usually are wild!



edit: On second thought...given a direction and assistance,I think I would like to help with this.

Jayson

[just_a_guy]

I've never seen concrete streets in the US and i've only seen a few with bright asphalt. But in Mexico (where I live) it's actually very common to see concrete streets. There's probably more concrete streets than asphalt where I live. Still though, I think it would be a great idea to have the dark textures be the default and ditch all together the maxis streets.

[j-dub]

Speaking of which, I remember when Heblem made such a fixed road to street transition to eliminate that Maxis one. Amazing how the same concept is being used, but these fixes actually don't look the same.

Also, I finally was able to try the American Maxis style draggable curved roads retexture, and noticed that very first public testing version, the high wealth seems to have been fixed with the smooth curves, where as the low wealth zones still retained their sharp Maxis texture curves.

[dedgren]

Out stimulating the local economy...



I'll join the discussion after lunch.

Later.


David

391811

[ldvger]

Camping???  CAMPING?!?!?  You call that camping?  Camping is a tent on the ground, cooking over an open fire, drinking hobo coffee, and a shovel with a roll of TP on the handle.  THAT'S camping.   

Well, I have to admit that while that's how I camped when I was younger, I like my creatures comforts these days.  My tent is tall enough to stand upright in, I use a coleman stove and lantern, have camp chairs (for sitting around the fire at night), and a double-size inflatable bed under my sleeping bag. 

All this talk about roads and textures has my brain spinning (and no, it's not because of the wine, it's only 2:30 in the afternoon, for heaven's sake).  And, more to the point, in regards to my requests for information about how to make my own custom roads, it seems like I do have almost all the software tools needed, just don't know how to use them (yet).  I downloaded iLive's Reader this week and re-read Tropod's Beginner's Guide for same (which I printed out back in '06).  I have the LE and the BAT.  I have Photoshop and GIMP.  I'll follow the links and download the other tools mentioned and then I'll see if I can figure out how they all go together.  I mean, way back when, the folks who are making roads now didn't know how to do it and had to learn, right?  Why can't *I* learn how, too?  I may be coming late to the game, in terms of creating custom content, and I may no longer be a spring chicken, but that doesn't mean you can't teach an old dog new tricks (how's THAT for murdering a metaphor?).

I have to agree with a lot of folks that here in the US there aren't many concrete roads and/or streets.  I am not totally sure why Maxis decided to create different colors for different traffic carrying capacity, maybe just to provide visual in-game clues.  But in RL I agree with Battlecat that asphalt is king for road surfaces and whatever variance exists due to expected carrying capacity is defined by width and stripping.  Would we be happy with monochromatic transportation systems in our games?  Not sure...maybe we have been conditioned to wanting the different colors for the different carrying capacities. 

Lora/LD

[sithlrd98]

Seems like I may have started something...sorry David! As I said though, if I can be of assistance if/when something like this does get off the ground , I will give what I can!
BTW , I have to agree with Lora...how can you call that camping? Back in the day , we had to hike for days to find a spot to set up camp , then we had to chop down a tree or two to build a shelter and weave grass and twigs to create walls and a roof. Then we had to make a fire with a piece of wood and a bunch of hopes! Then we had to go out and get some food..not from the corner store but from the land! And, we liked it ...We loved it! OK , so I'm only 33 and although I've never had Wi-fi and a laptop out in the woods , I did still have plenty of comforts.

Jayson

[ldvger]

sithlrd98/Jayson says:

Back in the day , we had to hike for days to find a spot to set up camp , then we had to chop down a tree or two to build a shelter and weave grass and twigs to create walls and a roof. Then we had to make a fire with a piece of wood and a bunch of hopes! Then we had to go out and get some food..not from the corner store but from the land! And, we liked it ...We loved it!

Well, at the ripe young age of 55, my meories date back to the early 1960's when my family was living in the San Gabriel Valley area of Los Angeles and we went camping twice a year, in May (before Memorial Day) and again in September (after Labor Day).  We usually went to Sequoia National Park, but once or twice went to Big Sur and Yosemite.  We camped in the snow one May.  We didn't own any camping equipment, so my dad would rent a big canvas army tent, cots, sleeping bags, Colemand stoves and lanterns, and a couple of big tarps.  We had a Rambler station wagon that my dad rebuilt on a yearly basis and which overheated fairly regularely, so climbing into the mountains of the Sierras was always a very slow process, as dad would pull over to let the engine cool down every time it overheated.  We always left on a Friday night and usually ended up pitching camp in the middle of the night by headlights from the car, my mom and dad argueing while they set up the tent and us 3 sleepy, cranky girls watching.  One year we took the back road into Yosemite, which was still under construction and closed at night, so we slept in the loaded-to-the-gills car until the road opened in the morning.  I can remember the "Road Closed" sign in the glare of the headlights and my dad swearing under his breath, because we didn't have enough money to get a motel room for the night.  It took us almost all the next day to drive up the new pass into the park, as the road was mostly one lane dirt and there were frequent delays waiting for pilot cars and for equipement to clear the road.  We could hear the crews blasting the mountainside off and on through the day.  We camped that night at White Wolf Campground, which also happened to be the staging ground for a good deal of the raod building equipment and thier shadowy, monster forms scared my baby sister Kimberley so bad, my dad had to once again sleep in the car with her to keep her safe from the monsters.  It was also very cold, as White Wolf is very high up, as I recall, so we moved down into a lower campground the next day.

Back then the parks didn't have showers or flush toilets.  Water was from randomly spaced spigots located around the campground and washing was a major undertaking.  We had a big galvanized tub we would bath in, big enough for us kids to sit or kneel in, but my parents took stand-up baths.  The rented tarps were used to create privacy around the tub, but al fresco bathing at high altitudes in early spring and late fall can be a VERY brisk experience.  Mom would heat water on the white gas stove, but even so, it never stayed hot for long and rinse water was cold, brrrrrrr. 

Back then it was still OK to use deadfall wood for camp fires, so a good portion of every day was sprent driving around in the now empty station wagon and filling it up with wood.  You couldn't go after anything living, but anything down was fair game, so my dad had a good sized ax he would hew wood with and us kids would gather whatever we could find and carry back to the car. 

Bears, bees, and thieving jays.  No bear boxes at each campsite back then, so we locked the food in the car.  Bees came to visit at every meal and eventually my mom bought an array of fine mesh covers for food, but that didn't protect the food on our plates.  The blue jays were very bold, swooping down out of the trees and stealing food right off the table during a meal.  Chipmunks raided our supplies when we were away from our camp gathering wood, hiking, or visting the sights.  There are colonies of marmots in the rocks and while they didn't steal, I would often take a box of crackers over and feed them. 

But, as hard as it was, we all loved it and looked forward to it every year.  I ended up working in Sequoia National Park the summer I was 20 years old, working as a pantry cook in the guest lodge, probably the best summer of my life so far.  That was 1974 and I was till using the occasional mind-altering drug back then (I was a hippie-chick, after all) and I especially remember one full moon night climbing Moro Rock, stoned on LSD, and sitting way out past the barriers where it started getting really steep, with a couple of the rangers and other kids from the lodge, talking about how the Native Americans had considered the area sacred due to the majestic redwoods, the sequoia giganteum.  Having lived under thier branches for almost 6 months, I can only agree...and when I die, I want my ashes scattered there.

As an adult, I continued camping, usually solo, in May and September, until my last car was repo'd while I was a student at The Art Institute of Seattle back in 1994.  Hard to go camping without a car, so these past 15 years have been a big dry spell for me...and I miss it, terribly.  When folks from out of state come to visit, we usually go camping for a couple of days and I had the singularely exquisite experience to taking two of my friends camping who had never been in thier entire lives.  Turned them into devotees and now THEY camp twice a year.  I also got to return to Sequoia in 2007 with my son and his wife, a deeply nostalgic couple of days for me, as he was concieved just 2 months after I left Sequoia in 1974.  The park had changed a lot in 33 years, which made me kinda sad.  The lodge is gone, the village is, too.  Tarantulas still cross the road in the lower valley, the bees and the bears and the jays are still there, but the budget cuts supporting our parks have taken a toll.  There are fewer campgounds, reservations are a good idea.  Still, the trees are still there, in all thier dwindling glory.  They are not expected to survive much longer.  The entire western US was once covered with these ancient giants, from the Mississippi to the Pacific Ocean, but all that's left now is that small patch in Sequoia and King's Canyon parks, with isolated groves of 2-5 trees here and there.  We have a few groves here in Washington, and one lone sentinel standing just outside the entrance to the School of Forestry at the University of Washington.  It had to be moved about 10 years ago when the building was added on to and I read that, at the time, it was the largest living object ever moved...that survived. 

If any of you are not familiar with these awesome trees, google them.  Better yet, go see them for yourself...the experience will enrich your life forever. 

Now I want to go camping, wah!   

Lora/LD

[nerdly_dood]

Camping???  CAMPING?!?!?  You call that camping?  Camping is a tent on the ground, cooking over an open fire, drinking hobo coffee, and a shovel with a roll of TP on the handle.  THAT'S camping.  

Couldn't a' put it better myself!

(although my dad and I tend to use a small camp stove using pressurized gas fuel you don't have to pump - it's very compact, lightweight and reliable.)