Prism Tower Condos

[ponnie]

Hi there, RadicalOne,

Glad to see you on these forums. I saw your latest creations on the STEX and I really liked them  . You show great BATting potential. You made the right choice coming over here, because, like you said before, comments here at SC4D actually are constructive. Best of luck and I'm eagerly waiting for your first releases on the LEX.

[tag_one]

I tried it as I understand it, but the SimCity glass texture is rather poor - random colored rectangles overlaid on a small building from street level - making for a poor texture overall.

Yeah I was already expecting that. It took me ages to find something that looked nice in the game and I'm still struggling with it 
Here's the texture I used for the RNP Properties building I made. Dunno if it will fit your building well as it was made for a 2x2 building with only 26 floors But you'll get the idea. I use only one texture for all the windows, than I select all the windows and give them 1 UVW map.


I usually make those textures in zoom level 3 in SC4.

btw, I love the new look of the tower. The mechanical floor and the wings work out very well 

[callagrafx]

Changed the thread title to something a bit more appropriate for the content 

[Diggis]

Wow, seems I've missed a bit since yesterday...

Firstly people, you can't really model them to be not static, but that's not a huge problem really.  People aren't usually going to stare at a building long enough to be worried about that, and most do know the limitations . Additionally, as this is Resi I would suggest a lot more stuff on the balconies.  Seats, clothe lines, bikes, anything you can think of.  Bear in mind the level of detail isn't high, so a lot will get blurred, but it will be seen enough to break the building up.

Secondly, I like what you have done with the lobby and penthouse.  Works quite well.  As for the lift overrun, no one said the whole area had to be penthouse.  Lifts only need a box slightly bigger than them for over run and if the penthouse was also the top level of the tower below it could serve as both.

Finally, the opacity of the fin.  There are a couple of things you need to know here.  When a normal render is output anything more than 50% see through will become invisible and anything less that 50% see through will become solid.  There was a trick using the reader to change some setting which will make them show as intended, but Cogeo has developed a tool to Automate this.  Search for SC4 Model Tweaker on the LEX I think.  

A couple of things you will notice if you do a practice on this though is that the item is darkened due to it rendering with the black background and then being 50% see through.  The way around this is to change the rendering environment to something close to your Fin colour so when it renders it doesn't change colour and when it becomes transparent it will show correctly.

Hopefully that wall of text isn't too much for you.   Looking good.

[RadicalOne]

Here's the texture I used for the RNP Properties building I made. Dunno if it will fit your building well as it was made for a 2x2 building with only 26 floors But you'll get the idea...I usually make those textures in zoom level 3 in SC4.

I'll download that one just in case, and you have pointed me in the right direction on how to make textures. Thank you.

I use only one texture for all the windows, than I select all the windows and give them 1 UVW map.

That's a good idea.

Changed the thread title to something a bit more appropriate for the content

Good idea, though I can't help but find the current title a bit awkward...

Firstly people, you can't really model them to be not static, but that's not a huge problem really.

Good point, but I tried and am unable to texture a human.

Additionally, as this is Resi I would suggest a lot more stuff on the balconies.  Seats, clothe lines, bikes, anything you can think of.  Bear in mind the level of detail isn't high, so a lot will get blurred, but it will be seen enough to break the building up.

I'll do that.

When a normal render is output anything more than 50% see through will become invisible and anything less that 50% see through will become solid.

Yes, that's what happened when I tried.

There was a trick using the reader to change some setting which will make them show as intended, but Cogeo has developed a tool to Automate this.  Search for SC4 Model Tweaker on the LEX I think.

Oh, thank you.

The way around this is to change the rendering environment to something close to your Fin colour so when it renders it doesn't change colour and when it becomes transparent it will show correctly.

That would do it - but how to change it? I can't find any options to that effect...

EDIT:
I can't preview render if I have too much detail - so I have a number of lawn chairs on the balconies, and that's it for balcony props.

Anyways, these are the changes made so far:
1. Balcony "junk" was added, including bikes and chairs. People were too difficult to texture.
2. Some textures were repaired, but I'm having trouble with the reflection texture - the building won't map it properly, and I need to set the UVW to something small, like 12x12x12, or I end up with pixelation, no matter the texture size.
3. The vertical support columns were enlarged and thus visibly lightened, as they are no longer completely embedded in the glass.
4. The fin material was made transparent, as yet only applicable in preview renders - I won't go for the patching program until after the model is complete.
5. The roof was rearranged, with 2 large HVAC units added.
6. The mirrored floor tiles in the lobby were given a better texture.

Here it is:
Please note that the fin transparency is currently unfinished, and ignore those tiny specks to the right of the fin - image transmission error.

[Leodido]

nice tower I really like it

[Diggis]

Much better.  I like the transparent fin.  Yeah, people are quite hard to model.  I believe at ST or Simpeg are some basic people models that you could use.  Bear in Mind a standard Sim is about 6 pixels in a BAT render. 

There is a post somewhere about changing the rendering background, I'm trying to find it with no luck.  It's only a month or so old so will link it if I do.

Edit:  I discovered how to do it.  Go to Views, Viewport Background and change the background colour to the one you want.

[zero7]

When I saw your uploads over at ST I thought here's someone who's new to BAT or has been working in isolation just creating stuff for themselves.  It was obvious you've got some great ideas - especially as you're coming up with the designs rather than copying real-life buildings - but that you're BAT technique couldn't fully realise them.

The progress you made while reworking your residential tower is fantastic - it looks so much better than the original and I imagine you've learnt quite a lot in the process.

I hope you'll take what you've learnt and rework some of your other models.  I think one of them was a hospital (red and white building), which was an interesting shape and could be worked into a really good building.

Oh, and finally, welcome to SC4 Devotion 

[RadicalOne]

When I saw your uploads over at ST I thought here's someone who's new to BAT or has been working in isolation just creating stuff for themselves.

You are partly right. Believe it or not, but all of those things that were (past tense) on the STEX have been in my system for over a year; I was indeed mostly creating them for myself.

The progress you made while reworking your residential tower is fantastic - it looks so much better than the original and I imagine you've learnt quite a lot in the process. I hope you'll take what you've learned and rework some of your other models.

Yes, they certainly need it. As soon as this one is complete (is it?), I'll light it, get a green light on that, and move on to another. My Dyson Sphere Antenna is probably next in queue.

I think one of them was a hospital (red and white building), which was an interesting shape and could be worked into a really good building.

Yes, that one was perhaps my worst in terms of modeling quality. The problem is I make (or perhaps made, past tense) my addons more for necessity - a large capacity medical center in this case - than for showing off the model.

I discovered how to do it.  Go to Views, Viewport Background and change the background colour to the one you want.

No, that's not it. All it does it change the viewport color. Not the render background color.

EDIT:
Well, this thread's sister thread on the other SC4 Site - which will remain unnamed - came to a rather dramatic - for a forum - termination; I walked out in disgust.

[tamorr]

   Some people expect too much in some forums, as for me I look at how I would use any Lot I DL in game, and judge quality at the level of the author. It doesn't take a whole lot to please me, unless it happens to be something that is truly unrecognizable for the function intended. There are even exceptions to that in my oppinion, like Future, Past, or Fantasy like buildings.
   I definately like what you've done with this, and glad you were able to sort out and learn a few things as well. I am still only a beginer to BAT, so I don't know a whole lot. However I am good at math and geometry, as well visualization beyond 3D. I may have a sight for it, but not the skill yet to impliment what I invision into BAT. It is nice to see more and more people BAT or well at least trying to use the program....

[Diggis]

No, that's not it. All it does it change the viewport color. Not the render background color.

For me it does both.  I've just tested it with a crappy render and it works fine.

[RadicalOne]

OK, I got it working.
Transparency is complete.
Here it is - with transparency included - is it ready for lighting?

[SimGoober]

This really has come a long ways.  Looking very good!

One minor tweak I might suggest playing with.  The top "crown" appears to be sitting on top of the building, not anchored well.  I was thinking that the outside frame for it could be "bent" a little to line up with the ouside of the building.  Can't tell from this angle how the side looks, but that bottom fin at the bottom could be a solid line up the side? Then the frame for the sail up top blends right into it?

Just soimething to play with.

[RadicalOne]

One minor tweak I might suggest playing with.  The top "crown" appears to be sitting on top of the building, not anchored well.  I was thinking that the outside frame for it could be "bent" a little to line up with the ouside of the building.  Can't tell from this angle how the side looks, but that bottom fin at the bottom could be a solid line up the side? Then the frame for the sail up top blends right into it?

What you are suggesting is essentially the same as one earlier in this thread. I really liked this idea, and tried it. Unfortunately, it made the top fin overpoweringly large. A derivative of that was in fact the source of the thick steel shaft that goes down each side (zoom in really close between balconies, you'll see it as a dark shape), and later, the lower fins. Much of the detail on this building is small - look closely, and you'll see the steel runners on either side of the base of the fin that become the vertical shafts. As I said on the other thread before I left, a structure as large as this fin would have steel joists going into the roof several meters into the building's support columns. Which is impossible to see normally, but should be visible (highlighted along with the side shafts) in this image. Keep in mind the main support columns, which the joists fuse into, have been hidden here to expose the fin's foundation.

[cerulean]

Hi there, I've been wrangled over here to offer some help 

Nice building! My only comments are that the crown is a little too big.

I'd be interested to see a slightly closer look at the balconies if you have one. The texturing looks a little bland from this zoom, and the technique merjin pointed out for texturing windows is time tested and true, though I create a different texture for each building and like to throw some abstract funky light streak type things an generally dirty them up just a tad in photoshop. (I wrote a tutorial on this somewhere .. years ago .. dunno if it is still around).

I like the proportions of most of the building though. The top is a little big imo though. Another big thing I just learned about as I am actually taking modeling classes at the moment, is beveling edges with just 1 extra plain can really go a long way towards making the lines of things like that crown stand out. To do this you would go into the model's sub object mode. You would need to put on a Edit Poly modifier most likely to get there. Select the edges, and 1 of the options on the right should be chamfer (not bevel .. 3ds seems to call camfer and bevel the same thing in different places ..).

My advice would be to take your time, and really play around with some things for your first big release. One thing you will learn in the long run is that updating is a major pain .. and in fact, most times it's not worth it, no matter how much you would want to teak some aspect of it.

[tag_one]

Do I see 6 spotlights aimed on the crown? Oh I can't wait to see a preview 

And I agree with Joe (Cerulean), always take your time. I know that your first uploads are very exciting and you can't wait to share it (I had that at least and I still do have it) But it's always worth to try different things with your building and see how it looks. Maybe you end up with something cool and you can use it successfully on future projects as well.

[Evillions]

I use the B.A.T so don't worry. The fin has to go or needs better support. I mean, like add some buttresses or a tree type sturcture before adding that fin, you know? So it still needs more refinement and textures and such before the final product is finished. For nightlighting, all I can tell you is get more nightmaps or use omni lighting for those light poles and such. It gives more life into the building. But for the base, I can give you this:        . Good work!

[RadicalOne]

I'd be interested to see a slightly closer look at the balconies if you have one.

How's this?

The texturing looks a little bland from this zoom, and the technique merjin pointed out for texturing windows is time tested and true, though I create a different texture for each building and like to throw some abstract funky light streak type things an generally dirty them up just a tad in photoshop. (I wrote a tutorial on this somewhere .. years ago .. dunno if it is still around).

I don't know about dirtying it - I like the clean "utopian" look for everything - but the texturing is indeed bland; I still have poor textures. Here are all of them:

Unfortunately, I have real trouble with the UVW mapping of a tower-wide texture. I get pixelation unless I make the UVW something very small, and then I have the cityscape repeating...

The top is a little big imo though.

I'll try shrinking it.

beveling edges with just 1 extra plain can really go a long way towards making the lines of things like that crown stand out.

I'll certainly do that; it sounds like it might do quite a bit.

Do I see 6 spotlights aimed on the crown? Oh I can't wait to see a preview.

You do, but I'm going to finish the model before I activate those.

The fin needs better support. I mean, like add some buttresses or a tree type sturcture before adding that fin, you know?

I have two ideas for this. One, I can add two more (one on each side) perpendicular struts that go from where the "center" solar collector is to the top of the fin's skeleton.

Two, I can use another idea from the inspiration for the design of this fin. This fin was inspired by aquatic fins and insect wings, so, in the style of the latter, I can run it through with smaller veins.

The first is (much) easier, but the second will look better, I think. Which sounds better?

So it still needs more refinement and textures and such before the final product is finished.

Oh yes, I definitely need better textures. See (and laugh at) my textures above.

For nightlighting, all I can tell you is get more nightmaps or use omni lighting for those light poles and such.

I have the NDEX nightmap set - It didn't do too much good over my nightmaps. I have a promising lighting idea (based on omni lights) for the main tower, and the lighting for the fin is already complete.

[DebussyMan]

Actually, I liked your original fin version with the radiating cones, but maybe instead of a single glass finish you could use something lighter like metal joints or a lattice, with or without glass, in the likes of this:

[Diggis]

Plant life is the hardest thing to model.  Not sure how subdivided the hedge geometry is but I would suggest using edit poly and varying it up a little.   While it's possible the hedge would be well maintained there is likely to be some dying, some overgrown etc.  This would again break up the repetition of the building.

I'm not going to comment on the spire as there are better qualified people than I who already are, but it is a very large piece of glass so maybe making it look like a series of smaller pieces (maybe mounted on a lattice inside with glass on both sides) would look more realistic.