Blank menu items?

[2natgali]

 

I just downloaded a set of T-RAM stations for the RTMT addon, and it's associated menu items are all blank yet I can click and plop them on the map.  It is only the new items that are blank. Am I missing a dependency?  I have the latest NAM and RTMT installed.  I'll try and post a screenshot

[Rady]

I do have the same effect for some different custom stuff (gas station set) ..

[2natgali]

Yeah, me too.  For a Chevron set I believe?  Am I missing an image in the plugins folder...hmm. It does get a little irking! 

[Diggis]

It sounds like the menu icon is missing.  Can you please provide more information on the lots that are doing it IE what lots exactly and where did you get them.  If it's the RTMT from the LEX we need to look into why it's happening as this shouldn't have got past scruitineering.

[2natgali]

I downloaded the stations and RTMT from the LEX, yet I get the problem with a Chevron gas station lot from STEX...possibly the same as Rady?  I'll try and find out what packs they are from.  Could it be conflicting lots?

[TiFlo]

I too am having that problem. Only with LBT lots form the STEX though. I have gas stations (Esso, Shell, Texaco, Petro Canada and the Travel Center, from the top of my head), tollbooths and the Telmex Communication building from them whose icons show as a blank space in the menu. Yet, I can click on that blank space, select the item and plop it. The wierd thing is that if I try putting them in a DAMN menu, their respective icon does show up in the different set up screens. But once I'm in game and open up a DAMN window: blank icons for the said lots...

I've never bothered investigating or asking as it doesn't distract me much, but since you guys seem to be having that problem as well, a little extra input will probably not hurt.

[2natgali]

Hmm maybe I'll try removing DAMN and see what happens

[k808j]

This problem seems to occur with the LBT menu icons. When Sim City starts up go to where you change visual effects and change from 32bit to 16bit and you will then see the icons.

[CaptCity]

This problem seems to occur with the LBT menu icons. When Sim City starts up go to where you change visual effects and change from 32bit to 16bit and you will then see the icons.

Yes, this came up some time ago with some of the LBT lots due to the way the icon images were made. Heblem and I other traded a couple of messages and discovered the reason. Switching to 16 bit will permit the icons to appear. As for the RTMT lots, I haven't experienced the problem so I can't say if it's the same issue. (See my post below)

[Rady]

I have gas stations (Esso, Shell, Texaco, Petro Canada and the Travel Center, from the top of my head),

Exactly - that's what I'm talking about. So can I convert the icon image to 32 bit by ourselfs? How would that be done - just open in image editor and change the image settings?

[CaptCity]

Yes, I managed to "fix" the LBT icons I was having the issue with by finding the image files (with the Reader, I think), resaving them with an image editor (MS Paint), then importing them into the game using the LEProp program. I can't recall anything more specific than this right now, but I do know it's possible. I'll have to dig through some old posts to see which lots I changed and how - if no one comes along with  a better idea...


After some serious digging... I remembered how I did it... First, I opened the lots in the Reader and exported the files. From those I found the icon image file and opened it in Paint. I saved it as a 24-bit BMP, then reopened and save it as a PNG. After that I used LEProp to import the new image into the lot as the new icon. The image would then appear in the game menu. (I just re-tried this again, and it worked.) If I remember correctly, it was the Bit Depth property of the images that was causing the problem. The original icons were created with a Bit Depth of 8, but the game needs 24 at the 32-bit setting. There very well may be an easier method to do all this, but it's what worked for me. For what it's worth....


Oh yes, 2natgali, did you remove the file named RTMT_Road_Textures_Euro from the T-RAM Station folder? That's the file that contains images used in the menu. Even though the file ends with "Euro", it needs to be in the plugins for all versions. Just a thought...

[RippleJet]

Oh yes, 2natgali, did you remove the file named RTMT_Road_Textures_Euro from the T-RAM Station folder? That's the file that contains images used in the menu. Even though the file ends with "Euro", it needs to be in the plugins for all versions. Just a thought...

Not sure what to think about that thought...
The installation instructions aren't very specific on what to install and what not to...

The contents of this package should be extracted to someplace in your Plugins folder.  Maintaining the folder structure in this package is strongly recommended.  Not all files should be used at once; it is probably easiest to extract everything and then delete the files you don't need, as described below.  However, you can also install just the files you need, if you wish.

If I'd live in USA, I'm pretty sure I would not wish to install any european road textures... and nowhere does it say that I need to install them...
The reference "as described below" only refers to the deletion of one of the high or low capacity stations, but doesn't say anything about any other files...

There are two files in the package containing the name "Euro"...

• RTMT_Lots_T-RAM_Euro.dat
• RTMT_Road_Textures_Euro.dat

I understand this is not the final package, but since it was uploaded on the LEX,
an explanation that only Euro lots and textures are available at this stage would have been appreciated.

Besides, I'm not really sure why these two files are separated... as far as I understand they are both equally much needed.
Ploppable items usually have a few needed external files, the item icon and possible LTEXT files containing the item name and item description.

Since these external files are always needed if you use the lot, it's been common practice to include them all in the same SC4Lot or DAT file.
All item names and item descriptions have been translated to several languages, and these are indeed included in RTMT_Lots_T-RAM_Euro.dat.

Thus it seems a bit strange to lift out the item icons and bundle them with two road textures into yet another file.
I don't think this was the case with RTMT 3.50, where the item icons were properly packed together with the corresponding lot file, e.g. RTMTV3_Lots_US.dat.

[z]

I had thought that the "as described below" was specific enough; I don't recall having any problems along this line previously.  However, if another sentence or so in the documentation will avoid future confusion, I will be happy to add it.

I can understand why the file structure when looked at by itself seems a bit unusual.  It's the same file structure used in the rest of RTMT, but as not all of the functionality present in the rest of RTMT was needed at the time of creation of this package, it may look a little unusual.  I used this file structure because it's extensible, so that if American-style lots or textures were added in the future to T-RAM, or the package was filled out with additional road textures, as with the rest of RTMT, the package could be upgraded for existing users easily without causing problems.  There have been some additions of shelters to this package over the past year, so the upgrade compatibility has been important, but there have been no American textures for T-RAM roads made, nor have there been any of the variations that are standard in the other RTMT files.  As a result, the file structure is still the same as it was when the package was first created.

So the reason the two Euro files are separate is that there is actually a potential for two different Lots files, as well as a potential for different Textures files.  Furthermore, the Lots and Textures files can be combined in any of the four possible combinations.  Typically, there are two Textures files to choose from - Euro and Standard.  In the rest of RTMT, the two different Lots files are US and UK.  The Lots files determine which side of the road everything is on and which way things face, while the Textures file determines the road texture type.  This is the way things were in v3.50, and by and large, it is how they are throughout RTMT today.  However, I noticed last year that the Lots files (starting with v3.50) aren't actually differentiated the way they're supposed to be.  I conferred with Cogeo, and after some research, he agreed, and he also agreed to my suggestion to eliminate the dual types of Lots files.  Although this will simplify things a lot, this involves a major restructuring of RTMT, which is why it hasn't been done until now.  It is scheduled to be done in the next release (v3.70).  The Capacities files are also being reduced to one per package (versus the current two), so this will allow them to be combined with the Lots files, as they are in most applications.  The end result will be a greatly simplified file structure.

As for the icons being bundled with the Textures file (which is true for many parts of the v3.60 Add-On Pack as well), the reason for this is that the icons graphically illustrate the lots essentially by using their textures; in fact, they are actually created from the textures.  Since the Standard and Euro textures may be different for the same RTMT station, they therefore need different icons.  By putting the icons in the textures file, the correct icons are always associated with the correct textures.  The reason this system was not present in v3.50 was that the icons were very different and not based on the textures, but everyone (including Cogeo) agreed that they were too hard to read, and thus the current, easier-to-read system was born.

So I will fix the documentation in the next day or so.  My apologies for any confusion it caused; I know very well the importance of clear documentation, and I didn't realize this was ambiguous.  I will be sure to remove any ambiguity here.  And the v3.70 release will come with an automatic installer, so that should further reduce the possibilities of confusion and error.

[cogeo]

Maybe naming the lots file RTMT_Lots_T-RAM_Euro.dat is what causes the confusion. The texture files in V3.xx were named Standard (SC4 default /American/unmodded) and Euro (for the Euro roads texture mod), with the only difference being the road texture (double yellow line for Standard, white dashed line for Euro). The lot files were named US and UK, but this concerned the driving direction (and subsequently props and textrures placement). And as Steve said, all four combinations are possible, so these were and (should be) packaged as separate plugins.

People in Europe drive at the right side of the road! Left-hand driving side is for the UK and the Pacific region. So it should rather be named RTMT_Lots_T-RAM_UK.dat (as in V3.xx), or RTMT_Lots_T-RAM_LH.dat if you prefer. 

[z]

Unfortunately, I think that Americans would be confused by any of these names.  (We're an easily confusable bunch. )  So instead, I've gone for a more comprehensive solution.  At first, I tried putting in clarifications, as I described in my previous post.  But by the time I was done, the whole thing was so specific that it was starting to look like a legal notice.

So I took a fresh look at things.  What was making things complicated was the need for the user to choose one of the two capacity files.  But as of the next version of RTMT, the lower capacity file is disappearing anyway, so I decided that I might as well get rid of it now.  Countless tests by both me and the RTMT testers have shown that this in no way affects existing stations built with the low capacity settings, so this change is completely backwards compatible.

Once I did this, all the complications in the installation went away.  The installation instructions now basically just tell the players to unzip all the installation files, and they're done.  No choices to be made, no configuration files to be deleted.  This should eliminate most causes for confusion, and should serve this package quite well until the end of its life when it is merged into v3.70.

I understand this is not the final package, but since it was uploaded on the LEX,
an explanation that only Euro lots and textures are available at this stage would have been appreciated.

I did add this explanation anyway, since people still may wonder about the naming scheme.  However, I separated it slightly from the main installation instructions, so as to keep those concise and simple.

[k808j]

z,

Just like you said, 3.70 will have an installer to eliminate the human factor of error as long as the individual follows the instructions