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Road/Street to Avenue...

Started by videosean, May 28, 2008, 03:27:28 PM

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videosean

You know, if there's one texture (that came from maxis) that just BEGS to be changed because it looks kind of bad and a little wrong I think it has to be  the road to avenue transition pieces.  Is there a reason it hasn't been done?
I started to mess around with it, not quite how I want it yet... making progress though.

The yellow paint through the chevrons isn't brighter, it just looks that way because those lines are 2x wider.

TEG24601

I like the idea.  Perhaps there should be merge right arrows on the left lane of the downward traffic (they are becoming more common across the US, from my observations).  Of course, I'd love to see those wider yellows on the regular road, and yellow lines on the median sides of the avenues, but that is a different topic.

TEG

Tarkus

videosean, that looks way better than the Maxis textures for that transition.  I really like what you've done with them. :thumbsup:

TEG, unfortunately, the way this transition is set up in-game, it would likely be quite difficult to do merge arrows. 

-Alex (Tarkus)

kassarc16

I think a whole new transition would be nice, ala the RHW2 to RHW4.

TEG24601

Quote from: Tarkus on May 28, 2008, 10:45:40 PM
TEG, unfortunately, the way this transition is set up in-game, it would likely be quite difficult to do merge arrows. 

Even a single arrow on the transition itself?  It was just a thought.

TEG

dedgren

QuoteYou know, if there's one texture (that came from maxis) that just BEGS to be changed...

Oh, many, many textures from Maxis beg to be changed.

Either that, or horsewhipped.


David
D. Edgren

Please call me David...

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Ryan B.

And how!

Very well put, David.   :D

Tarkus

Quote from: TEG24601 on May 29, 2008, 12:14:10 AM
Even a single arrow on the transition itself?  It was just a thought.

There is the T21 option as well--that's how the stop lines will be implemented in the next RHW version.  It'll make it possible to have arrowed and non-arrowed transitions in the same city, too, at least in theory.

Quote from: dedgren on May 29, 2008, 12:25:33 AM
Oh, many, many textures from Maxis beg to be changed.

Either that, or horsewhipped.


Biggest understatement of all time. :D

-Alex (Tarkus)

Filasimo

my my my i do believe that prototype is wrong, according to MUTCD standards it is suppose to look like this: http://www.flashearth.com/?lat=36.192025&lon=-86.411094&z=20&r=0&src=ggl
well thats just my two cents  ;)
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Tarkus

Quote from: Filasimo on May 29, 2008, 12:40:09 AM
my my my i do believe that prototype is wrong, according to MUTCD standards it is suppose to look like this: http://www.flashearth.com/?lat=36.192025&lon=-86.411094&z=20&r=0&src=ggl
well thats just my two cents  ;)


Well, I'd say what videosean has is as close to RL as one can get sticking within the Maxis limits.  Perhaps some sort of extended setup like kassarc16 was talking about may be a solution.  I've kind of thought the Maxis one was too short myself.

-Alex (Tarkus)

Diggis

Quote from: videosean on May 28, 2008, 03:27:28 PM
The yellow paint through the chevrons isn't brighter, it just looks that way because those lines are 2x wider.

Looking at it, it is actually brighter as the yellow in the maxis streets isn't one yellow, its got a lot of noise in there.  When doing up textures I have used the photoshop noise filter to simulate this.

allan_kuan1992

I never noticed the transition, but the Maxis textures of course now seem very unrealistic compared to your new textures =O

- Allan Kuan

JoeST

Brilliant work your doing here

Thanks

Joe
Copperminds and Cuddleswarms

videosean

#13
TEG24601: I might do a single merge arrow.
Tarkus: This T21 thing... does it require 2 tiles (one with and one without an arrow) or would it use a seperate arrow overlay texture of some kind?
Quote from: Filasimo on May 29, 2008, 12:40:09 AM
my my my i do believe that prototype is wrong, according to MUTCD standards it is suppose to look like this: http://www.flashearth.com/?lat=36.192025&lon=-86.411094&z=20&r=0&src=ggl
well thats just my two cents  ;)
Hmmm... well for starters I do believe that is much like an RHW2 to RHW4 split in your link (which I appreciate since I couldn't find one of those transitions the other day when I wanted to) and I would compare it to this and say that the link you gave might not be in the strictest accordance with the MUTCD either... if I wanted to argue.  Since the Maxis avenue is 2 roadways seperated by a median strip my double yellow does need to get seperated, just like the highway in your link.  I cite this as my reference for splitting my double yellow line.  I prefer the chevrons over something like this using just angled lines... I don't think I've deviated from their standards but it's hard to find a diagram that matches this situation perfectly.  In the real world it seems that using either angled lines or chevrons at a lane split or exit/entrance is fine and I couldn't find a rule or reason*see edit below* on when to use which... but maybe I should consider just keeping the left yellow lines, losing the chevrons and make the inside look more like the end of an avenue between the lanes.
Quote from: Diggis on May 29, 2008, 12:51:20 AM
Looking at it, it is actually brighter as the yellow in the maxis streets isn't one yellow, its got a lot of noise in there.  When doing up textures I have used the photoshop noise filter to simulate this.
I was working with the tiles at 512x512 pixels and the double yellow is 3 pixels wide at that size.  Resizing down blurs those pixels into whatever the surrounding color is.  The wider lines are 6 pixels wide at 512 and inside the chevrons (more than 6 pixels wide but I only eyeballed those) you can still find the original pantone yellow 116 after resizing down.  I am thinking about putting some kind of blended texture overlay (or noise) on the yellow to simulate paint cracking or unevenness since fresh paint everywhere isn't quite the look I want - that would help tone down the brightness of double width lines I bet. I've been considering making the lines just a hair wider after comparing to the original road texture too:
<-full size - 128 bicubic-> bicubic sharper->
Maybe I should just do every road surface in the game to match what I'm making though.  I've been trying to make everything as undoable and changeable in the psd file as possible because right now I think I'd like to just get something completed and see how it looks in the game - I'll probably be able to see what definitely needs to change after that.

I still think this is the worst maxis texture I've found (I've only been looking over the past few days though and focusing on road stuff) because the lines aren't all that straight and especially when the avenue's asphalt magically fades into a street's concrete :D  It makes me think whoever made this transition wasn't the one who made the roads or road/street transitions.

If the idea of remaking it completely (different number of tiles) goes through don't forget the diagonal avenue to road/street in the NAM as that one is only a single tile as opposed to ortho being 2x2 tiles... and we need proper RHW2 to avenue pieces too ;)

Thanks for the comments and input :)

*edit*

After some more thought I think with yellow lines and 2 way traffic chevrons are wrong.  They only make sense for splitting 2 lanes of traffic that flow in the same direction.  Using this as an example at Fem st and Concord Ave you can see that the lines are angled such that oncoming traffic is sort of directed by them to the right.  The chevrons are used for splitting 2 lanes of same direction traffic because each lane needs to move out from the center (you can see white chevrons in the roundabout to the east of Fem st along Concord ave) which explains why MUTCD shows white but no yellow chevrons.  Filasimo is right.

The REAL Tolsome

very nice :)

what programm you use?

MandelSoft

#15
Even though I don't like American stuff, that's a wonderfull job what you have done, videosan!  :thumbsup:

EDIT: Oops! I filled in the wrong name! :o
Lurk mode: ACTIVE

Andreas

Quote from: videosean on May 29, 2008, 03:37:49 AM
Maybe I should just do every road surface in the game to match what I'm making though.

I wouldn't recommend that. ;) There are a helluva lot of road textures in the game; take a look at the SFBT Euro Road Textures Mod to get an idea of the work that would have to be done...
Andreas

videosean

Quote from: Rechi on May 29, 2008, 04:33:43 AM
very nice :)

what programm you use?
Photoshop using shape layers and layer styles mainly.
5 pixels wide at 512x512 seem to match Maxis' double yellow.  Need to rework the inner curve of the median so it's actually circular but I think I can live with this look more than the inner curbs coming to an end on each side like I had before.

TEG24601

Quote from: mrtnrln on May 29, 2008, 04:46:59 AM
Even though I don't like American stuff, that's a wonderfull job what you have done, TEG24601!  :thumbsup:

Thanks, but it wasn't me... it was videosean.

TEG

The REAL Tolsome

very nice  :thumbsup:

but make it more dirty, please ;)