Sydney Opera House - For one night only!

[noahclem]

Such a shame to see people testing and looking critically at their work before publishing     This is a model project for how to do something difficult and get it done right.

[Swordmaster]

Yes please, do NOT let this "little" test take a couple years.


(Great work really.)


Cheers
Willy

[callagrafx]

There's never been any problem with meshes extending below the LOD, as that's how I did the canals...

Not to be rude but your canals actually do suffer from the same problem.

Taken from the very first development shot...



Nary a shadow there... And if I recall, they are actually props, not buildings, which also if I recall don't cast shadows.

[Diggis]

Lee, the Pic from Vortex is what happens naturally to props when there is Mesh below ground level. Props do cast shadows, just look at all the trees.  However, there is a setting in the prop exemplar is ground model which you turn off to avoid that issue. It's what I had to do to all my stream and pond pieces. I've just checked and your sets have it set to false too, meaning they won't cast shadows.

[BarbyW]

I have also checked Lee's canals and also Jeff's. Neither set show any shadows as vortext showed.

As regards the length of time being taken to develop the Opera House lot, BSC stands for and always has stood for, quality in the finished product. That is why the LEX has a candidate programme before uploading is allowed. It will take as long as it takes to get the model right and then the final lot so please don't post about things taking too long.

[BarbyW]

Double posting again

Made a prop over a blank building lot. Put the sandy base down to see if that made a difference but it doesn't then forgot to replace with the grey. Anyway the odd shadow is gone.

[Diggis]

I have also checked Lee's canals and also Jeff's. Neither set show any shadows as vortext showed.

As regards the length of time being taken to develop the Opera House lot, BSC stands for and always has stood for, quality in the finished product. That is why the LEX has a candidate programme before uploading is allowed. It will take as long as it takes to get the model right and then the final lot so please don't post about things taking too long.

That's because, as above, they've had the is ground model set to False in the prop exemplar. If you turn that to true it'll cause the issue seen by vortex.


Take a look at the exemplar of the prop you made and see what the setting says? You'll note, all shadows onto the ground are gone. Only the ones projected onto the model are showing up, which looks odd.

[BarbyW]

I have also checked Lee's canals and also Jeff's. Neither set show any shadows as vortext showed.

That's because, as above, they've had the is ground model set to False in the prop exemplar. If you turn that to true it'll cause the issue seen by vortex.


Take a look at the exemplar of the prop you made and see what the setting says? You'll note, all shadows onto the ground are gone. Only the ones projected onto the model are showing up, which looks odd.

I left the Ground Model set to True for the Opera prop. I think vortext must have made a set of exemplars himself for the canal pieces and not changed the True to False.

[callagrafx]

That's because, as above, they've had the is ground model set to False in the prop exemplar. If you turn that to true it'll cause the issue seen by vortex.

That's because vortext must have changed that setting himself, because they were all set to false...I do that as a matter of course with props. And I'm really not convinced that the game knows there was a mesh there, especially considering all it sees are a series of bitmaps that are mapped to a LOD, which then uses an alpha channel to remove the background.  The LOD itself sits at dead z=0 and at no time is any mesh that's below the ground plane visible to the camera. 

Another thing to note, if you turn the game renderer to software (as I have to, as the game flickers like mad on HW rendering on my machine), the shadows are gone too, which is why I didn't see the issue before I sent the model to Barby.

[vortext]

Well, I just redownloaded and installed the canals to check if it wasn't because of my own tinkering; it is not. Though on initial plopping there're no shadows, if you zoom in and out and rotate a few times they'll appear. So unless this is something inherently due to my pc, one should be able to reproduce it. Also, all prop examplers in fact have the 'is ground model' property set to true.

Another thing to note, if you turn the game renderer to software (as I have to, as the game flickers like mad on HW rendering on my machine), the shadows are gone too.

That's no solution either since the recent HD terrain mods require hardware rendering, i.e. lots of people play in hardware rendering.

Hope I'm not too much of a buzzkill, I just want this gorgeous building to be perfect ingame! 

[BarbyW]

Changed to s/w render and look:



No strange shadows so it is definitely a game graphics problem. I shall now add the water tiles again and see it it is still OK.

[Diggis]

Well, I just redownloaded and installed the canals to check if it wasn't because of my own tinkering; it is not. Though on initial plopping there're no shadows, if you zoom in and out and rotate a few times they'll appear. So unless this is something inherently due to my pc, one should be able to reproduce it. Also, all prop examplers in fact have the 'is ground model' property set to true.

I've tried to replicate that with a fresh download and can't.  They never show shadows for me.  Can you check the settings for the is ground model? If it says false is should never show shadows and the version I downloaded did say false.

Changed to s/w render and look:

No strange shadows so it is definitely a game graphics problem. I shall now add the water tiles again and see it it is still OK.

Barby, What is the setting for is ground model on that?  If it's set to false, you won't see the main shadows for the model either.  You'll only see the shadows baked into the model by the BAT, not the shadows across the base texture etc, which should be there.

[vortext]

I've tried to replicate that with a fresh download and can't.  They never show shadows for me.  Can you check the settings for the is ground model? If it says false is should never show shadows and the version I downloaded did say false.

I'm starting to doubt my own sanity now. Did you try the same set I linked to? (i.e. this one). If so you should be able to reproduce it.

I just re-redownloaded it to make absolutly sure and wether anyone likes it or not, in the version I download the examplers have is ground model set to true, thus giving rise to weird shadows.

Maybe, somehow, perhaps, I get an outdated download?? 
Upon installation the date and timestamp for CAL_Stone_Canals_Base_Set.dat is 4-5-2010 16:58. Would be great if anyone could verify this, too, before I consult a shrink! 

[BarbyW]

Changed to s/w render and look:

No strange shadows so it is definitely a game graphics problem. I shall now add the water tiles again and see it it is still OK.

Barby, What is the setting for is ground model on that?  If it's set to false, you won't see the main shadows for the model either.  You'll only see the shadows baked into the model by the BAT, not the shadows across the base texture etc, which should be there.

This is the original lot not the one with the prop on, hence no ground model setting as this is a building.

vortext, you have the Stone Canals set and are correct in that the prop exemplars are incorrectly set to True. I'll correct that set with Lee's permission and, if I can remember how to make the installer will upload the new set.  Lee, Shaun and I checked the original set which have the correct setting so we have been comparing different sets.

[vortext]

Lee, Shaun and I checked the original set which have the correct setting so we have been comparing different sets.

Hehe    That explains it then. Now back to topic, I hope the shadows will be fixed, would be a shame if this building goes without any.

[BarbyW]

I have solved the odd shadows by changing to s/w rendering and can confirm that adding the water tiles and plopping it on water doesn't have the odd shadows either.

[callagrafx]

I have solved the odd shadows by changing to s/w rendering and can confirm that adding the water tiles and plopping it on water doesn't have the odd shadows either.

I've re-rendered the model with automatic LODs and while the shadows are still a bit off, they're nowhere near as bad... I'm now going to do a test render with all geometry on the 0 z plane and then see what happens.  Finally if no shadows are wrong, I'll add a new custom LOD.  If that screws up, I'm going home!

[BarbyW]

Okay, I'll wait for the new model/s.

[sandrasim1]

If that screws up, I'm going home!

I thought that you were at home.       Seriously it's great work from both of you and I do hope this shadow problem can be fixed.

[callagrafx]

Got fed up with trying to solve the problem...



More later...